| By WAQAS on Monday, November 29, 1999 - 05:52 pm: |
I AM A MUSLIM STUDENT FROM LAHORE PAKISTAN. I'VE READ ALL THE STUFF STATED ABOVE.
I WOULD LIKE TO CLEAR SOME MISUNDERSTANDINGS GOT ROOTED IN THE
MINDS OF OTHERS NATIONS ABOUT PAKISTAN.
FIRST OF ALL MIND IT THAT PAKISTAN IS AN ISLAMIC STATE. AS A MUSLIMS WE ARE BOUND TO OBEY ISLAM (OUR RELIGION). TO REFER US AS FUNDAMENTALIST IS A MIS-WORDING." IF U R OBEYING YOUR RELIGION; YOU ARE FUNDAMENTALIST". IT IS THE MEANING OF FUNDAMENTALIST.
ISLAM IS A RELIGION OF PEACE. IT IS AGAINST WARS. BUT IF THE MUSLIMS IN ANY PART OF THE WORLD ARE KILLED & MISBEHAVED BY OTHERS,THEN ISLAM PERMITS US TO GO FOR A WAR TO SAVE OUR
MUSLIM BROTHERS SUCH AS IN KASHMIR.
I ACCEPT IT THAT THE FIGHTERS, THAT ARE FIGHTING IN KASHMIR ARE PAKISTANI. BUT THEY ARE ONLY PROVIDING A HELP TO THEIR MUSLIMS OVER THERE. HUNDREDS OF
KASHMIRI PEOPLES ARE DAILY KILLED BY INDIAN ARMY. INDIAN GOVERNMENT BANNED
ALL THE MEDIA TEAM TO VISIT INDIA BECAUSE
INDIA WANTS TO HIDE FACT FROM OTHERS.TELL ME WHY THE PROBLEM OF KASHMIR IS NOT STILL RESOLVED ACCORDING
TO RESOLUTIONS OF UNO BECAUSE ACCORDING TO UNO RESOLUTIONS KASHMIR IS A PART OF PAKISTAN. WHY THE REFERENDUM IS NOT STILL HELD AS PROMISED BY INDIAN FIRST PRIME MINISTER MR.NEHRU.?
OTHER THING THAT IS ACCORDING TO ISLAM" WOMEN & MEN ARE NOT EQUAL" DESPITE THE FACT THAT BOTH ARE HUMAN BEINGS.
ISLAM GIVES THE WOMEN THEIR FULL RIGHTS, WOMEN ARE FREE TO DO EVERY LEGAL ACTIVITY.
BUT THEY ARE UNDER MAN. AS EVERY COUNTRY HAS HIS RULER SIMILARLY MAN IS THE MASTER OF HIS WIFE.
I ACCEPT IT THAT DUE TO LESS KNOWLEDGE SOME PAKISTANI MAN TREAT THEIR THEIR WIFES BADLY BUT AS ALL THE FINGERS OF A HAND ARE NOT EQUAL SIMILARLY THERE ARE SOME GOODS & BADS
EVERYWHERE.
ACCORDING TO ISLAM THE BEST MUSLIM IS ONE WHO TREATS HIS WIFE WITH
GREAT AFFECTION & LOVE.
SO IT'S WRONG TO SAY THAT MAN DON'T RESPECT WOMEN IN PAKISTAN. I AM A
PUNJABI BUT I WOULD LIKE TO SAY THAT OUR
"PATAN" BROTHERS RESPECT A LADY MORE THAN PUNJABIS"
" PATANS" ARE A GREAT NATION. ABOUT
HOMOSEXUALITY ALL PATANS ARE NOT INVOLVED IN IT, EVEN PUNJABIS DO IT. OH! LET ME ADD THAT AMERICANS ARE MORE ADVANCE IN THIS FIELD THAN PATANS.
PLEASE DROP A MAIL TO ME ON ADIN@WOL.NET.PK if u wanna to say sth to me.
and the other thing is that Pakistanis respect
the CHRISTIANS, HINDUS & ALL OTHER COMMUNITIES SETTLED HERE IN PAKISTAN.
MR. SUFFERING IS NOT SAYING THE TRUTH. HE IS ABSOLUTELY WRONG TO SAY. INFACT HE WANTS TO SPREAD A PROPAGANDA AGAINST PAKISTANIES. OH MR......IF U ARE READING IT MAIL ME KNOW........WHAT YOU ARE SAYING....IF YOUR SISTER IS BEING FUCKED BY ANYONE IT DOESNOT MEAN THAT EVERYONE IS FUCKER HERE IN PAKISTAN.
ANY PAKISTANI PREFER IT TO EAT POISON THAN •••• OWN SISTER.......I'M REALLY SURPRISED BY YOUR THINKING......
THERE ARE MORE CRIMES IN INDIA & USA THAN PAKISTAN....OK.....YOU HAVENOT SEEN THE WORLD MY DEAR..& U DON'T KNOW WHAT IS A CRIME.....OK.....
OK friends don't feel reluctant to mail me..I'm waiting................................
waqas................from LAHORE
| By Anonymous on Thursday, December 02, 1999 - 09:15 am: |
keep waiting bakwas. nobody is gonna write to u
| By paki desi1 on Wednesday, January 05, 2000 - 12:55 am: |
•••• u all
| By frompakistan on Tuesday, January 18, 2000 - 07:01 am: |
I am a Pakistani living in USA. I have lived in Pakistan for a long time. I also visit Pakistan on a regular basis. I can not seem to understand where is all this talk about women in Pakistan being treated badly to the extreme is coming from. Being in Pakistan I never heard men beating their wives and stuff like that any where arround. We have many relatives and know a lot of people there. As a matter affect, I have always seen women being treated very well. If you go to bazaars and places, the women are everywhere, doing their stuff just like evrybody else and men being respectfull everywhere to ladies. I am sure some people are bad and are doing bad things but in general this is not what's going over there. I am so surprised to read all this while I am Pakistani from Pakistan and Have been there for so long. Everyone we know in Pakistan, they treat their mothers, sisters, daughter, wives even better than men in their famalies. The women are usually protected and very much cared for. I am sure ther are exceptions but that's everywhere. In US, women are treated just like everybody else, but in Pakistan I have mostly always seen women being treated with extra respect.
| By Anonymous on Tuesday, January 18, 2000 - 11:46 pm: |
is it also false that you stone your women to death???
| By frompakistan on Wednesday, January 19, 2000 - 05:42 pm: |
I am soorry but I am just not going to get into petty arguments. If you enjoy bashing us Pakistanis (or Indians for that matter), that's upto you. What you are trying to show is that this is the norm in Pakistan. Well it is not. Bad things do happen and they happen everywhere, not just in Pakistan. Pakistan's police and other government agencies are corrupt and as Pakistanis we are very much concerned. None the less, women live normal lives for the most part and it is definately not like what is being portrayed in this forum.
| By razia on Sunday, January 23, 2000 - 11:01 pm: |
These men from pakistan sound so innocent. I pity them for they have not yet seen what their fathers do on daily basis to their women. I am sick upto neck of these idiots who know nothing but defend a male dominated dogmatic faith which permits these monsters to torture women. This is the only site on the net where one can talk freely. I tried to post my messages on more than 6 Paki sites but they rejected, deleted or banned me. I only pray for someday God will listen to the crying women whose faces and bodies are burnt with poisonous acids.
I want to ask frompakistan and other posters here who claim that Pakistan is a heaven for women, if they have done any survey or seen what is going on here in the name of religion. The poorly educated massive society based on male ego in Pakistan is doing nothing but increasing population. They are so impotent that they can not defend democracy what can you expect from these men. Are they going to defend women ? They can not defend themselves. The only easy way out for them is to harass women.
What Pakistan does to its women is a matter of not shame but of scare. You have no idea what we are going through in this country. Women are shot, maimed, killed and tortured by their own family people for minor things. There is no possibility of getting out of this horrifying and cruel system, further bulldozed by the disgusting misuse of religious monsters.
You may remember when few years ago a maulavi was in news for he used to torture one of his younger wives with a hot iron rod on daily basis on her genitals in the cosy setting of his own home. Pakistani newspapers did print that story but nothing happened. That man is free and he married yet another woman.
Now read this report:
Husband burnt her wife by hot iron later putted acid on her serious burn injuries in Pakistan:
KARACHI: The Vice Chairperson of the human and civil rights organisation
"Ansar Burney Welfare Trust International" Mrs. Shaheen Burney has demanded
an immediate arrest of the husband who burnt his wife's all body by hot
iron later putted acid on her serious burn injuries in Karachi.
According to details one Zia Ahmed, resident of Sadar, Karachi, after
quarrel with his wife Mst. Farah, burnt her all body with hot iron later
putted acid on her burn wounds and locked her in a room, where she was
locked for five days in a very painful condition without food or water.
After having come to know about the incident, Advocates of the Ansar
Burney Welfare Trust International rushed the incident place and got her
release from the custody of her husband.
Her condition is very deteriorating, Doctors of the Trust are trying to
save the life of innocent Farah. The incident occurred on Monday January
17, when Farah, asked her husband for her legal rights.
However, after five days later when Mr. Ansar Burney, Advocate came to
know about the incident from some sources he sent Volunteer Advocates at
the incident place who took badly injured Farah to Civil Hospital.
Shaheen Burney said that women are always neglected in our society where
they are living a life which is worse than the animals in the male
dominating society.
Mrs. Shaheen Burney renewed Ansar Burney Trust's pledge to continue battle
against honour killings (karo-kari) in the name of so-called custom. She
said that the need of today is to equip women with the tool of education so
they could effectively fight this evil, and that the "Ansar Burney Welfare
Trust" had placed honour killings on its top priority.
She said that from October 1998 to September 1999, 595 innocent people
were murdered in Sindh province alone in the name of karo-kari (honour
killings), out of which 346 were females and 249 males. 50 per cent of such
women were killed by their husbands and 20 per cent by their fathers and
brothers, she added.
Shaheen Burney called for an immediate legislation to curb this totally
unIslamic custom of killings for honour. A killer is a killer and
punishable under law, She said.
Shaheen Burney said that every year hundreds of innocent women and girls
are murdered in the same circumstances but nobody hears their hues and
cries, She demanded an immediate stop of such killings of innocents and
requested the well to do people to come forward and help "Ansar Burney
Trust" to helping the helpless.
| By frompakistan on Monday, January 24, 2000 - 07:21 pm: |
Dear Razia:
Thanks for your post. There is a lot of injustice happenning in Pakistan specially to women. We are not dennying that. What I am saying is that in this forum what is being portrayed is that Pakistani men are cruel(bad to) towards women in GENERAL. Just because certain number of men and government agencies are treating women badly and unjustly, does not mean that the Pakistani men in general treat women bad. The God that has created you is the same God that has created us and given us heart just like you. Just because we are borned in Pakistan does not mean we do not have a heart.
| By ASAD on Thursday, February 03, 2000 - 09:51 pm: |
PLEASE I WANA GIRL FOR SEX AND MAIL ME BACK
| By tinytim on Thursday, February 10, 2000 - 11:35 pm: |
From an article I read in One World Many Cultures, it stated that arrangement of marriages were done by the bride or groom parents and the bride and groom did not meet until the day of the wedding. And this process of matching the two together could become long. Is all of this truthful?
| By Princess on Monday, February 14, 2000 - 01:29 am: |
tinytim,
In many cultures throughout India arranged marriages did take place where the bride and groom had never met, seen eachother or talked to eachother. To an extent I'm sure they still take place in rural areas. But arranged marriages are a norm and take place to this day and maybe not as it used to be in olden days but they are still very much part of the culture.
| By Editor on Wednesday, February 16, 2000 - 10:24 pm: |
Afghan's Bengali author-wife beaten up
Calcutta: An Afghan money-lender's Bengali wife, who made a daring escape from Kabul to Calcutta and wrote two novels based on her experiences, was attacked allegedly by four Afghans for criticising the Islamic way of life.
"Who are you to state how many times Hazrat Mohammed had married?" they asked, adding "what audacity for a woman!" The attackers gained entry into Susmita Banerjee's residential complex by claiming to be friends of Jambaaz Khan, Banerjee's husband. They also vandalised her home, smashing up furniture, mirrors and a telephone.
The assailants were referring to two books written by Banerjee, notably Kabuliwalar Bangali Bou (the Afghan's Bengali bride) that had made her famous some time ago. Recently, her second book Afghan, Taliban O Ami (Afghan, Taliban and I), in which she criticised the Taliban and their fundamentalist ways, infuriated some Afghans living there. Her second book was released at the just-concluded 25th Calcutta Book Fair.
The vandals fled when Banerjee's Afghan brothers-in-law, who live in the city, reached the scene. While three of them escaped, the fourth was caught by Khan's brothers and was taken away by them. It is not known whether he was handed over to the police.
Banerjee said she did not regret writing about her experiences in Kabul and nothing would prompt her to change her beliefs. However, she refused to say anything on the incident.
Banerjee had married Khan, an Afghan money-lender in Calcutta, and travelled to Kabul thereafter. But she fled the home of her in-laws, owing to the rigid social norms, and came back to Calcutta to write her experiences in Kabuliwalar...
Banerjee's escape from Kabul had earlier made big news. She had walked across to Pakistan from Afghanistan and contacted the Indian Embassy in Islamabad, which helped her return to Calcutta. In her first book, she complained that excessive oppression had forced her to flee Kabul and join her husband, who was then in Calcutta. The book created a sensation because of its off-beat theme and was serialised in newspapers.
Bengalis have traditionally had a soft corner for Afghans not only because they cater to the borrowing habits of lower middle-class Bengalis but also because poet Rabindranath Tagore has immortalised an association of Afghans with traits like "basic honesty and innocence" in his famous story Kabuliwala.
| By Anonymous on Thursday, February 17, 2000 - 02:22 am: |
Kabuliwala was a nice story.Makes one feel sad after reading it.
| By noor on Wednesday, March 08, 2000 - 12:34 pm: |
Dear Sir, I Don,t know what kind you working. Please kindly be verify first, thanks,
your Noor
| By lov on Sunday, March 12, 2000 - 04:22 am: |
I was searching for pakistanian food recipes and I found this site. I read every single message in this site. I'm not pakistan but i have to say not all of them are the same. I have a really great friend who's from pakistan and I have to say he is a great person and he treats me with a lot of respect and caring. I'm sure in pakistan there's bad and good people like everywhere else. I do admit they have to obey Islam. If it wasn't for that I think we had a better chance of loving each other and getting married because I'm from another country. I know his family won't accept me as one of theirs because I'm not from pakistan and I'm not a Muslim. To all the people that are suffering in Pakistan, I sincerely pray to God to take away your pain and change your life for a better one.
| By forever on Wednesday, March 15, 2000 - 07:19 am: |
met a india guy online. would like to know more about marriage . am in ohio he in india. if we married am amercian. what is it like in inda. also like to know the marriage rulels do you have malls in india . homes and cars. thanks. a lady who needs more infor thanks. forever@spillguts.com ps am married now. if I went to india he married me without divorce, would it be ok or not/ am in ohio thanks.
| By ak on Wednesday, March 15, 2000 - 10:57 am: |
Dear forever ,
I don't know what is your impression about india . But some of queries seems funny . India is not a hell . There also you can find all amenities you find in Ohio.
But a word of caution .. It is not going to be easy to get married to an Indian .. Not to discourage you ,but to prepare you of the obstacles ahead . In a normal Indian family , it is very difficult to accept a forgiener as a daughter/son in law.
Indain law don't permit a woman or man to marry if he/she is already married . you have to get divorce first to legaly marry in india.
AK
| By Anonymous on Sunday, April 09, 2000 - 09:36 pm: |
wassup, this site sucks!
| By Anonymous on Monday, May 08, 2000 - 02:26 am: |
I have met a pakistian online that lives in tokyo, japan. after I got to know him, he started to call me everyday for 4-5 hours at a time. He want me to marry him but I'm not familiar with his upbringing. He said first we will get to know one another and go from there. I just want to know more about marrying a pakistian especially if he's betraying himself as the "perfect gemtlmen." He said that we could live here in the states if I didn't want to go to japan. He want me to come and visit or he visit me but I don't know since you hear so many misconception on pakistians.
| By Anonymous on Monday, May 08, 2000 - 02:56 am: |
Hey Anonymous be watchful this guy must be after some status or something. There are many South Asians in different countries whose dream is to be in the US. They will do anything to do so even sell their soul. I know many cases where Pakistani and bangladeshi men did all the tricks they could use to get into the US and once here and get papers they run away.
Be careful. At this moment the only door open to Pakistanis and bangladeshis is through marriage and they will do anything to get out of their country or wherever they are. Japanese wont let anyone live in their country for too long so the guy wants to jump anywhere he can as nobody wants to return to pakistan. I am Pakistani and know their stories thats why i write this.
| By Anonymous on Tuesday, June 13, 2000 - 07:19 pm: |
From : Pakistan forum at southasia.net
Women sold in Pak markets
Islamabad, June 12: Women are being sold like animals in mandis
(markets) in several places in the troubled Sindh province of
Pakistan, a human rights activist has alleged.
Shaheen Burney, vice-chairperson of Ansar international welfare
trust, said this anti human practices are taking place in markets of
Thar and other parts of Sindh under protection of influential
politicians, the Business Recorder of Pakistan said in its report on
Monday.
Giving details of the sensational news, she said buyers of these
unfortunate women fix their prices after examining and scanning their
bodies. They take advantage of the situation and humiliate, molest
and sexually harass these women in public like in animal markets.
The practice was also witnessed in several areas of the Thar
district and some other parts of the province, the trust president
alleged.
Shaheen, who recently visited these areas, recorded interviews of
the victimised women on video, who were fraudulently brought to these
areas and markets from Punjab (Pakistan) and Bangladesh, the paper,
quoting Shaheen, claimed. These women are compelled to live in
miserable and humiliating conditions along with their illegitimate
children. Those who buy them usually recall them to others when they
no longer require them.
Shaheen condemned and accused corrupt bureaucrats and influential
political and patronising such ugly and barbaric activities which
were thriving and flourishing in the province. She demanded a high-
level investigation into the killing of a journalist Sufi Mohammed,
stating that those involved in buying and selling of women had been
shielding the culprits in the case.
| By Anonymous on Saturday, July 08, 2000 - 12:52 pm: |
i would like to INFORM all those who are reading that
WOMAN is not to be disgraced sa she is beening done
TODAY.She is most impotent part of our LIFE.She should be respected and LOVED.Try to understand her role in the socity.She has been creaited by THE GOD ALLMIGHTY
to be loved and respected. Think and THINK.
| By Zadi on Sunday, July 09, 2000 - 03:44 pm: |
just contact with me on my e-mail
| By RANASAHIB on Sunday, July 23, 2000 - 04:28 am: |
I HAVE COME ACROSS THIS SITE BY ACCIDENT - BUT IT IS NICE TO KNOW THAT PAKISTANI BASHING AND ISLAM BAHSING CONTINUES APACE!!
THE TRUTH OF THE MATTER IS THAT THERE IS GOOD AND BAD EVERYWHERE.IS IT NOT TRUE THOUSANDS OF WOMEN EVERY YEAR IN INDIA ARE BURNT TO DEATH FOR THE SAKE OF DOWRY?
INDIA AND INDIANS SHOULD NOT FORGET THE GLORIOUS HISTORY OF ISLAM IN INDIA AND THE HERITAGE IT BEQUEATHED INDIA. EVEN TODAY A BBC DOCUMENTARY 'DELHIS DJINNS' RECOGNISED THE FACT THAT HOW ALL COMMUNITIES LIVED PEACEFULLY UNDER ISLAM. IT POINTED OUT THAT THE FIRST COMMUNAL RIOTS TOOK PLACE UNDER BRITISH RULE. COMING FROM A BRITISH CHANNEL THIS IS SOME RECOGNITION.
AS FAR AS PAKISTAN IS CONCERNED - THE WORLD IS LUCKY THAT PAKISTAN DOES NOT IMPLEMENT ISLAMIC LAW - YES ITS RULERS DO SAY IT IS AN ISLAMIC REPUBLIC BUT LOOK AT THE FACTS. EVERY LEADER HAS PROMISED TO IMPLEMENT SHARIAH LAW - MEANING THERE IS A NEED TO IMPLEMENT IT. SECULAR LAW HAS IMPOSED ON BOTH INDIA AN ELITE THAT IS BRITISH CULTURED AND THEREFORE HAS IMPOSED WHAT OUR COLONIAL MASTERS WISHED. THERE IS A SAYING IN PAKISTAN THAT WE ARE THE RICHEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD BECAUSE ALL OUR RULERS HAVE ROBBED US YET WE ARE STILL IN EXISTENCE!!! THIS IS THE SAME CASE IN INDIA YET THE MEDIA PROPAGATES THIS DEMOCRACY RUBBISH!!! LOOK AT THE POVERTY A COUNTRY OF INDIA'S SIZE AND RESOURCES SHOULD NEVER HAVE TO FACE THIS PROBLEM.
TODAY INDIA IN ITS FOREIGN POLICY IS CHOOSING THE ALIGN ITSELF WITH THE WESTERN ALLIANCE AGAINST ISLAM. THIS WILL PROVE A DANGEROUS STEP. THE REASON FOR THIS IS IT STRENGHTENING TIES WITH RUSSIA, AMERICA, BRITAIN AND EVEN ISRAEL. YES THESE ARE THE PREVALENT POWERS TODAY - BUT FOR HOW LONG. IT IS FACT ACCORDING TO ISLAMIC EVIDENCES THAT AFTER THE LAST PROPHETHOOD THE MUSLIMS WILL GO THROUGH VARIOUS STAGES OF RULERSHIP WHICH ARE 1) RIGHTLY GUIDED CALIPHATE 2)BITING MONARCHY (I.E. ISLAMIC RULERSHIP BUT WITH SOME CORRUPT RULERS)3 OPPRESSIVE MONARCHY (NO ISLAMIC RULERSHIP I.E. PRESENT 4) AND RIGHTLY GUIDED CALIPHATE. MUSLIMS ALL OVER THE WORLD ARE REALISING THE NEED TO BRING BACK THE LAW OF ALLAH - THE KHILAFAH OR CALIPHATE. REMEMBER PRIOR TO INDIAN INDEPENDENCE THERE WAS A MOVEMENT IN INDIA FOR ITS RESTORATION THEN AND EVEN HINDUS ALIGNED THEMSELVES WITH THIS CAUSE. INFACT GHANDI SITED IN 1937 THAT THE BEST RULERS WERE ABU BAKR AND OMAR BIN KHATTAB - THE FIRST 2 CALIPHS. FURTHERMORE IT IS ALSO APPARENT THAT HINDU BOOKS SUCH AS THE VEDAS POINT TO THE FACT THAT THE LAST AVTAR WILL BE OF ARAB ORIGIN.
TO ALL THOSE INDIANS AND NON INDIANS WHO THINK THAT THE FRIENDSHIP OF AMERICA AND BRITAIN IS THE BEST WAY; REMEMBER THIS SAYING OF LORD PALMERSTON (UK FOREIGN MINISTER ) WHO SAID THAT BRITAIN HAS ' NO ETERNAL FRIENDS ONLY ETERNAL INTERESTS'.
WHAT THE US WANTS IN KASHMIR IS FOR THE UN TO SEND ITS SOLDIERS IN UNDER THE GUISE OF PEACE WHO WILL INFACT BE US SOLDIERS. THIS WILL GIVE THEM A STRATEGIC ADVANTAGE BECAUSE OF THE PROXIMITY WITH CHINA AND THE HEIGHT OF THE REGION. FROM THIS IT CAN CONTROL CHINA IN THIS NEW CENTURY WHEN MOST ANALYSTS PREDICT CHINA WILL BECOME A SUPERPOWER. REMEMBER THIS IS THE SAME POLICY IT IS PURSUING IN THE GOLAN HEIGHT ANOTHER STRATEGIC POINT.
I WILL ONCE AGAIN WARN OF THE FUTURE CERTAINTY THAT ISLAM WILL ONCE AGAIN RISE TO SUPREMACY AND SAY ALVIDA WITH THE SAYING:
" WHEN THE LION LEAVES THE JUNGLE EVEN THE DOG CAN BECOME KING"
YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!!!
| By Z3 on Friday, August 11, 2000 - 10:47 pm: |
To RANASAHIB
Don't be so stupid. The Vedas or Any Hindu Holy book does NOT say the last Avtara will be an Arab, and it's an insult to even think so. Mullah's tried to corrupt the scriptures and threated hindus with death if this was not done.
There was no glorious history of Islam in India, it was just rape, torture, destruction and Hatred on the part of the Mughals(muslim invaders). The same thing they are doing all over the world (e.g. Indonesia) even today.
One thing you pakistani muslim's have got to be reminded about is that you all came from Hindu mothers. When the Mughals went to India, they went with no women and they raped the Hindu women and they were forced to convert to Islam. The Koran actually talks of killing and torturing non-muslims and this is exactly what they did in India. They were carrying out their religious duty. Trying to make it 'Islamic' land, like in Kashmir.
And you expect sensible people to have any respect for a so-called "religion" like that?! It's not even worth thinking about.
Muslims have not changed, they've only changed their methods of conversion, for this day and society. But they still have their agenda.
| By RANASAHIB on Sunday, August 13, 2000 - 02:48 am: |
TO Z3
BY SIMPLY SAYING THAT THERE IS NO GLORIOUS HISTORY OF ISLAM IN INDIA U ARE BEING BLINDED BY HATRED. FIRSTLY THE QURAN DOES NOT SANCTION RAPE OR MURDER. YES JIHAD IS ENCOURAGED BUT IF U READ THE QURAN LIMITS AND ORDERS ARE IMPOSED ON WHO IS A LEGITIMATE TARGET. FOR EXAMPLE "ALLAH DOES NOT LOVE TRANSGRESSORS". AS FOR THE RECENT KILLINGS IN KASMIR AN EX FOREIGN MINISTER OF INDIA HAS ADMITTED THAT IT CANNOT BE THE MUJAHIDEEN AS THEY ONLY TARGET MILITARY PERSONNEL. OTHERS HAVE POINTED THE FINGER ON FAROUK ABDULLAH WHO HAS THE MOST TO LOSE IN THE EVENT OF PEACE.
AS 4 THE LAST AVTAR BEING ARAB I WAS REITARATING A LETTER WRITTEN IN THE CORRESPONDENCE COLUMN OF THE DAILY MAIL (UK)BY A BRITDH HINDU. IF IT IS NOT TRUE - DOESN'T MATTER, AND SORRY FOR THE OFFENCE. U SHOULD ALSO REALISE THAT SWEEPING GENERALISATIONS ARE ALSO OFFENSIVE.
RE: IF AS U SAY THAT INDIAN WOMEN WERE RAPED AND THIS POLICY WAS DONE ALL OVER THE WORLD BY MUSLIMS THEN IT IS COMMON SENSE THAT PEOPLE (MUSLIMS)OF NON-ARAB DESCENT WOULD HOLD ISLAM IN CONTEMPT AND NOT BE PREPARED TO FIGHT AGAINST ALL ODDS FOR THEIR RELIGION. EXAMPLES SEE KASHMIR BOSNIA PALESTINE CHECHNIA 2 NAME BUT A FEW. FURTHERMORE A PERSON WHO CONVERTS UNDER DURESS WILL NOT FOLLOW THE NEW RELIGION IN PRIVATE AND HENCE HIS OFFSPRING WILL BE LITTLE AWARE OF IT. YET MANY OF THE GREATEST SCHOLARS OF THE 20TH CENTURY WERE FROM THE INDIAN SUBCONTINENT. THIS IS A BIT OF ANAMOLY? PERSONALLY THIS IS ALL PROPAGANDA OF THE LIKES OF RSS AND BJP AND THEIR ILK, AND THOUGHTS SUCH AS THESE SHOULD NOT BE ENTERTAINED SIMPLY TO WIN ARGUMENTS.
IN MY LAST MESSAGE I POINTED OUT THE BBC DOCUMENTARY "DELHIS DJINNS", WHICH COVERED HINDU-MUSLIM ANIMOSITY AND ITS ROOTS. IN THIS DOCUMENTARY THERE WAS A LEADER OF THE RSS OR SOMETHING SIMILAR WHO ACTUALLY VERY BOLDLY STATED HE WANTED INDIAN MUSLIMS OUT AND HE WANTED TO SEE THE INDIAN FLAG FLYING OVER PAKISTAN. IT WOULD BE VERY EASY FOR ME TO TAKE WORDS SUCH AS THESE AND DEPICT ALL HINDUS/INDIANS AS WAR HUNGRY MONGRELS. WOULD IT NOT?
AS FAR AS FORCE IS CONCERNED I REFER U TO THE QURANIC INJUNCTION "LA IKRA FIDEEN" - NO COMPULSION IN IDEOLOGY, AND SURAH AL KAFIROUN - WHICH ASKS THE PROPHET MUHAMMED (PEACE BE UPON HIM) TO TELL THE PEOPLE OF MAKKAH THAT THEY MAY WORSHIP WHO THEY LIKE AND LEAVE THE REST OT ALLAH.
ONE EXAMPLE THAT COMES TO MIND IS THE CONQUEST OF JABR-AL-TARIQ (GIBRALTER OFF SPANISH COAST). WHEN THIS WAS CONQUERED THE LEADER OF THIS ISLAND COMPLAINED TO THE KHALIF AT THE TIME THAT HE HAD NOT BEEN GIVEN THE INVITATION OF ACCEPTING ISLAM NOR TO PAY THE JIZYA AND THEREFORE BE UNDER THE ISLAMIC CALIPHATE. HENCE THE KHALIF CALLED THE ARMY BACK AND ASKED THE RELEVENT GENERAL TO FOLLOW THE PROPER PROCEDURES. THIS IS REMARKABLE BECAUSE MANY LIVES WERE LOST AND THERE WAS NO GUARANTEE THAT THE PEOPLE OF GIBRALTER WOULD ACCEPT THE INVITATION. IT SHOWS THAT THE CONQUESTS WERE NOT FOR THE PURPOSE TO FORCE THE RELIGION BECAUSE IF THEY WERE THEN NO WAY ON GODS EARTH WOULD THIS EVER HAPPEN. ASK ANY MODERN GENERAL TO MOVE HIS FORCES FROM OCCUPIED TERRITORY (IE, KASHMIR, PALESTINE OR CHECHENIYA) AND U CAN BET WHAT THE ANSWER WOULD BE!
THE PURPOSE OF JIHAD (MILITARY) IS SIMPLY TO REMOVE ALL OBSTACLES FROM HUMANS TO SEE THE RULE OF THE CREATOR AS WE FIRMLY BELIEVE IT IS, IN ACTION AND LEAVE IT UP TO THE PEOPLE TO DECIDE.
HAVE A LOOK AROUND THE WORLD AND SEE ANYWHERE WHERE THE POOR ARE NOT BEING OPPRESSED THIS INCLUDES ALL MUSLIM COUNTRIES. THE ROOT CAUSE OF THIS IS THAT RULING ELITES ARE SIMPLY FOR THEMSELVES AND THEIR FORMER COLONIAL MASTERS.
AS I SAID BEFORE A COUNTRY LIKE INDIA OR PAKISTAN SHOULD NOT HAVE NO POVERTY BECAUSE OF THE GIGANTIC RESOURCES BOTH NATURAL AND HUMAN. BUT UNDER VARIOUS GUISES SUCH AS DEMOCRACY OR NATIONAL INTEREST THE MAJORITY ARE ALWAYS LOSING OUT.
AS FAR AS MUSLIM RULE IN INDIA BEING OPPRESIVE I THINK YOU ARE BEING HARSH. I WILL BE THE FIRST TO ADMIT THAT MANY RULERS WERE CORRUPT - I POINTED THIS OUT IN MY PREVIOUS CORRESPONDENCE BUT SURELY IT WAS MUCH PREFERRED TO THE BRITISH. THE LATTER CONQURED AND PILLAGED THE WEALTH AND TOOK IT BACK. THE MUSLIMS CAME TO STAY AND ARE STILL THERE - DESPITE THE FACT THAT THERE ARE NOW FORCES IN INDIA WHICH EITHER WANTS THEM TO CONVERT BACK OR LEAVE.
ONE FINAL THING AS REGARDS OTHER RELIGIONS: IT IS MY BELEIF THAT ALLAH SENT REVELATION AND MESSENGER TO THE WHOLE WORLD NOT JUST A PARTICULAR PART (I.E .JEWS). ALTHOUGH NOT 100% SURE BUT SOME SCHOLARS HAVE PUT THIS FIGURE AT AROUND 124000. THEREFORE ALL MAINSTREAM RELIGIONS HAVE THE SAME SOURCE, AND EVEN TODAY CONTAIN PARTS OF THE ORIGINAL GUIDANCE. FOR A MORE ENLIGHTENED DISCUSSION A SITE I WOULD RECOMMEND IS www.beconvinced.com WHICH DEALS WITH COMPARATIVE RELIGION ISSUES IN MUCH GREATER DETAIL.
OK SORRY FOR LONG MESSAGE BUT PROBLEMS OF DELECATE NATURE NEED TO BE DEALT WITH THOUGHT AND INTELLECT NOT AS MANY OF THE OTHER MESSAGES ON THIS BOARD.
ALVIDA
| By smauloo on Thursday, August 24, 2000 - 01:57 am: |
well i think youre organisation is working in great style please help me in geting scholar ship for a levels
| By ranasahib on Monday, September 11, 2000 - 08:08 am: |
to all
I seem to have killed all debate - sorry for being too intelectual!!!
by the way a little bit of more political analysis. musharraf and vajpayee are both us agents. there plans are for public opinion be in the favour of a referendum on the kashmir issue so it can be united and declared independent and for this indias reward will be a seat on the permanent security council.
the big jihadi groups are insincere (their leadership) because they are funded by isi which in turn is funded and supported by cia.
an islamic group by its very nature should achieve islamic goals by islamic methods - once u enter field of jihad it is not permissible to leave unless victorious or martyred. hizb-ul-mujahideen revealed its true colours by announcing a ceasefire as being a tool of isi and ultimately america whose desire it is to have control over south asia. south asia is the only area where us forces are not present and this area is vital for US interests not only because of the proximity of china but simply because of the huge natural resources. both pakistan and bangladesh are rich in uranium oil and gas where india itself has a big market of middle class consumers and also cheap it literate labour market.
good bye
| By indian on Monday, September 11, 2000 - 12:06 pm: |
same old crap ranasahib.
Islam teaches that there is no God other than Allah and non-muslims go to hell.Contrast this with the hindu scriptures which say that there are many paths to reach the truth.
This in essence is what makes Muslims intolerant.
| By RANASAHIB on Wednesday, September 13, 2000 - 08:36 am: |
TO INDIAN
AS I'VE POINTED OUT PRIOR - PERHAPS U HAVE INTELLECTUAL DIFFICUTLY IN UNDERSTANDING! THE ARABIC WORD FOR THE CREATOR IS ALLAH U MAY KNOW HIM BY ANOTHER NAME BUT THE CREATOR IS ONE. I HAVE SAID BEFORE THAT THE QURAN SAYS LA IKRA FIDEEN - NO COMPULSION IN IDEOLOGY. MUSLIMS AND NON MUSLIMS LIVED PEACEFULLY FOR OVER A 1000 YEARS UNDER ISLAMIC RULE IN VARIOUS PARTS OF THE KHILAFAT - READ ABOUT THIS. LOOK AT GHANDI AND HOW EVEN HE JOINED THE INDIAN MOVEMENT FOR KHILAFAT IN INDIA. WHEN JEWS WERE PERSECUTED IN SPAIN WHERE DID THEY GO? 30% OF ISTANBUL WAS JEWISH - INFACT THERE MANY PEOPLE STILL IN THE JEWISH QUARTER WHO DISCOURSE IN HEBREW.
WHEN PEOPLE FAIL TO READ OTHER PEOPLES VIEWS AND THOROUGHLY RESEARCH THEM THEN THEY BEGIN TO LOSE SOMTHEING WHICH MAKES HUMANS DIFFER FROM ANIMALS - THE ABILITY TO RATIONALISE - INTELLECT. I DO NOT WISH FOR U TO CONVERT OR EVEN BEGIN TO ACCEPT MY VIEWS SIMPLY TO CONSIDER THEM. FOR U TO SIMPLY SAY ITS CRAP SHOWS THE LEVEL OF UNDERSTANDING U HAVE ABOUT HUMAN THOUGHT OR FEELINGS. REGARDING MUSLIMS BEING INTOLERANT I HAVE SAID MANY TIMES BEFORE THAT I CAN GIVE THOUSANDS OF EXAMPLES OF OTHER HUMANS OF DIFFERENT RELIGIOUS DISPOSITIONS BEING INTOLERANT (I.E. BABRI MASJID, HOLOCAUST, AND BOSNIA) BUT THIS IS NOT MY AIM.
I SIMPLY WANT PEOPLE TO ENGAGE IN HUMAN DISCOURSE ON A LEVEL OF HUMANITY AND INTELLECT. IS IT TOO MUCH TO ASK FOR IN THIS DAY AND AGE?
AS FAR AS NON-MUSLIMS GOING TO HELL READ THE QURAN AND IT TELLS U THAT THOSE CHRISTIANS AND JEWS WHO BELEIVE IN THE ONE CREATOR AND LIVE BY HIS LAWS 'LET THEM HAVE NO FEAR' AS THEY WILL ENTER HEAVEN.
I MENTIONED PREVIOUSLY REGARDING MOST RELIGIONS HAVING THEIR SOURCE AS THE SAME - AND THEREFORE THAT ALLAH HAS SENT GUIDANCE TO ALL HUMANKIND. NEVERTHELESS I DO NOT THINK THAT PRESENT DAY HINDUISM HAS ITS ORIGINS FROM GOD OR EVEN THE ORIGINAL REVELATIONS SENT TO HINDU RISHIS. I AM SURE THAT THE WORSHIP OF COWS, ELEPHANTS, MONKEYS AND OTHER CREATED THINGS IS SOMETHING THAT HAS NOT BEEN PREORDAINED BY ALLAH/THE CREATOR.
SURELY MOST INDIANS/HINDUS REALISE THIS? FOR THIS YES U ARE RIGHT - IDOL WORSHIPPERS AND OTHERS WHO PARTICIPATE IN ASCRIBING PARTNERS TO ALLAH/CREATOR WILL GO TO HELL - AND IS SOMETIHNG TO THINK ABOUT.
IF AS U SAY PRESENT DAY HINDUISM TEACHES THERE ARE MANY PATHS TO THE TRUTH THEN IT CANNOT HAVE MUCH CONVICTION IN ITS OWN TRUTH?
ANYHOW MY ADVICE IS SIMPLY FOR U TO READ THE MESSAGE WITHOUT PREJUDICE AND IF U ARE SINCERE IN YOUR QUEST TO GAIN KNOWLEDGE AND BROADEN YOUR HORIZONS THEN PLEASE DO SOME RESEARCH.
PEACE
| By Anonymous on Wednesday, September 13, 2000 - 09:32 am: |
I can't believe the BS that RanaSahib is spewing out of his filthy wrecked out propaganda mouth. If you look at all the wars / conflicts that took place, you can guarantee that Muslims were nearby whether it be in Desert Storm, the Indo-Pak wars (remember those Muslims who raped nuns during the 1948 war), Indonesia, Bosnia, etc...These sister marrying losers have this in their blood. When Muslim women were being raped in Bosnia, then they start to cry...but it's ok for them to rape other women and force them into their religion.
All I can say is that Rana - go back to Pakiland and start ****ing your sister and then your mother - cuz that's the only thing you are good for.
JAI HIND !
| By Arjun Singh Malhotra on Saturday, September 16, 2000 - 04:07 am: |
RUBI, You do sound like a nigga hoe.
| By Arjun Singh Malhotra on Saturday, September 16, 2000 - 04:13 am: |
Until muslims stop doing these actions, then there will never be peace among us. not that i want a peace at all.
Only sullahs will do these type of actions. Sikhs and Hindus, in my opinion, are much too good and clean-hearted than sullahs. Sullah's religion started out as GREED. Nuthin else. Its an economical religion which sees war, bloodshed, rape, and pillaging, as the way of gaining a hold and what they want. Totally intolerant of all others, even the cousin Semitic religions: Christianity, and Judaism. GREEDY, PRICKY SULLAHS!!!
You people turn Hindu and Sikh girls into "trophy fuc ks", and pretty soon, we're gonna (Hindus and Sikhs) convert your girls into our fold. Its already starting.
Muslims don't have enough balls to be Muslims when you see a female of a different religion, (Hindu or Sikh), thats why they gotta dress up as Sikhs or Hindus, and then get a Hindu or Sikhi girl.
US Sikhs and Hindu boys, the sullah girls just go to us, for one sole reason. They know they're gonna have a better life. They know in that pornographic book called the Koran and that eternal slavery of Islam they can have no freedom. I rolled 3 Paki hoes already. They don't want no halal penises. What kind of people cut their dicks? Its embarrassing. Paki girls want the real meat. Awaiting a multitude of replies............
| By nativetongue on Sunday, September 17, 2000 - 11:13 pm: |
what's up w/ all the hate?
NOBODY has a choice into the faith which they are born into. approximately 400 million muslims in south asia had no choice.
and ALSO if hindus claim that indian muslims are the descendents of forcefully converted hindus then arent the descendents of indian muslims the real victims here?, yet you all keep attacking them? what's the point? it doesnt make sense. It's like indigenious african people attacking african american people for being christian, a religion that was forced on them. If hindus want to get their point across that they belong to a more tolerant faith and that Islam is intolerant simply say that and back it up with evidence, dont resort to petty name calling and personal attacks. All you are doing is pouring gasoline on the fire. It's like you are looking to piss off muslims and get them even more hostile towards you. WHY?
I am of Pakistani origin, I come from a muslim family and although I havent renounced Islam openly because I'll be honest with you that would be suicide and I still find many aspects of Islam valuable (ie: 5 prayers, zakat, etc.), I study other spiritual systems including that of my ancestors, hinduism, buddhism, yoruba (west african), and native american faiths.
Lately, I have found myself finding the need to interpret G*d/Truth for myself. Be it Allah, Jesus, Yawheh, Brahma, what have you. I have taken the initiative to seek and understand him through my own mental cortex, without relying on the wisdom and experience of others. I embark this lonely journey with patience, perserverance, diligence, and with pure intentions. Pray for me, meditate on it with me, whatever you do. Just do it with sincerity. With all positive vibes in my mist......I commence.....
Yet I dont think many of you non-muslims realize how hard it is to question Islam when you are born and raised in that faith. It truly is an internal and external struggle to question what you've been taught is true since day 1 and come to a realization that perhaps it is not. And when people throw insults, this struggle gets harder, because everybody has a natural self-defense mechanism. When you say a muslim is this, is that, that is ME you are talking about, I have to take offense to it just as you may take offense to being called "kafirs". That kind of natural reaction on my part makes me less open to whatever point you are trying to make about Islam or Pakistan, because you make it a personal attack on all those labelled by CHANCE muslims and Pakistanis. BE SPECIFIC with those you wish to bash AND have some understanding and empathy basically or else you are no better than those that you condemn. Present your opinions with a kind heart and I'm 100% sure SOME people will be more open to it.
Some points for all: Never criticize without making a constructive suggestion. If you agree to talk about something that a person said or did always agree, or disagree, with the specific thing that the person said or did. Focus your talk in a manner that promotes ideas, concepts, and/or systems of doing things, and getting things done. Do not make remarks to any people with the intention of being insulting. Attack ideas, not people. Always say everything in a manner that will best promote justice and correctness. Minimize conflict, promote peace.
"let us live in joy, never hating those who hate us. Let us live in freedom, without hatred even among those that hate"
peace.
| By Anonymous on Tuesday, September 19, 2000 - 09:11 pm: |
Dear Humans
I am human first and hindu muslim parsee christian and etc later.
it is my drem to m,arry a rajistani indian girl. I care only people who love each other either from what communities thay are . No communal thinking is allowed in this century. Please my proposition are open for LIVE PROPOSAL.
| By jyoti on Monday, September 25, 2000 - 02:52 am: |
Hye my pakistani and indian brothers sister my name is jyoti ,I am in u.s.a but i love every thing about india and pakistan ,am 23 year old ,I have been read all site ,what i belive is we are all equal, there is one GOD, I wanna say to young people that respect your relgion ,but do not fight for relgion , belive in GOD, I read news about india and pakistan most of time i feel sad and feel sorry for people , you know what i think we still in 19th century still fighting for places. But you know who i blame to both countries goverments,For example if something happens in both countries who get hurt ,people our people our brothers and sisters, not goverment because they are sitting in there marble houses. now we have to think how we are going to stop that ,we can stop this if we become from muslim,hindu ,sikh,chritshen to one group , i am not saying that stop beliveing what ever you belive in , Give every body freedom to go to musjid or gurdwara , mandir , or church so every body can live their life , what i have seen is we are killing each other just for musjid ,gurdwara mandir ,churches. please we gotta stop this ,if you guys want to know my relgion , I go to church ,musjid ,gurdwara,mandir ,even to chinnse temple because my belive is GOD IS ONE ,god has been gives us these labels like sikh ,hindu ,muslim, christean so we can have our little community's ,so we can get together everyday or weekend .My people we do not have right to fight for those beautiful historical places , Rember we all have same color blood in our bodies, Those places are our memories, If you think that god feel happy when we fight and kills each other trust me god feels gulity, you know what he thinks he thinks wow i send these people on beautiful earth for live not for fight ,he feel sad so am i, please listen ,we do'nt want teach these things to our young people ,tell your young childern that god is one , think about it when four relgion get together , we can do anything in the world ,then there won,t be any hunger in our people no fear, I do know that ,when some one knows your weakness, they will take advantge on you, our weakness is that we are not together, we can not do any thing ,because we do not have time to think for something nice,because we are always fighting ,there were some comments on women's respect , women deserv respect,I think women should respect men ,men should respect women, another thing is RAPE this is very very dirty, but all i can say is those kind of tragedy's happen every where But the bad part is when you do'nt get justice , like i think in india and pakistan the people are suffring from tragedy's ,but there is no justice, that 's very bad and sad ,but what we can do is we can help them, if we give those my sister's respect ,but i know what my brother and sister's are going to say, but think about it , it can happen to any body , it 's crime ,but we have to punish . i have lot things to say but if any body have question email me @ jyotiforever@yahoo.com . i really want to do somethingfor my countries but i need help your help my people GOOD NEWS IS THAT I AM IN LOVE WITH PAKISTANI IF WE GET ALONG WE WILL GET MARRY. BECAUSE SOMEONE HAS TO CHANGE SOMETHING, WE ARE IN 21ST CENTURY ,PEOPLE ARE GONE TOO FAR AND WE ARE STILL WHERE WE WERE 20YAERS AGO, WAKE UP MY PEOPLE THANKS TO READING ME
| By Arjun Singh Malhotra on Monday, October 16, 2000 - 04:58 am: |
I am a Hindu Punjabi and all of my friends agree (even Sikhs) that sullehs are the cause of all the fighting going on in the world. Everytime they see something going on they don't like, they gotta go out into the streets and rub on their dicks. My family was thrown out of Pakistan for being rich, educated Hindu Punjabis. Seven people out of 15 got killed, and a teenage girl got kidnapped and was God knows where. I hope to God that we finally decimate the sullahs.
| By Anon on Monday, October 16, 2000 - 08:57 am: |
Arjun Singh Malhotra :
What about those muslims who were killed during the partition ? And those who are still getting killed and raped in India just because of their religion ?
How about the caste based killing going on in India ? Are the muslims to blame ??
Seems like your hindutwa comrades have started roasting people of the Christian Clergy? Are the muslims to blame for that too ?
Regards
Anon
| By Bren on Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 11:00 am: |
Hi, my name is Bren, I came across this site in error while looking for current news in Pakistan. I have been dating a Pakistani Gentlemen for several months and have agreed to marry him. I am always saddened by the harshness and cruel manner in which we verbally attack others of different geographical regions, races, and religions.Good and Bad resides in every country whether it be in men or women. I am grateful to be a U.S. Citizen, but I am not naive enough to think that this system under which we live is not also corrupt on many levels. Yet, it is the system in which we live, we can either work to change it for the better, or simply be a finger pointing citizen who sits on the sideline being a part of the problem and not the solution.I have no doubt this gentlemen loves me, but just for the sake of argument; if he came to this country under false pretenses, got married, and ran away it would be no different than the men who father children every day and run away to be chased down by the Justice System for Child Support. As Americans we tend to look down on the injustices of other countries, while turning our heads to the injustices taking place in our country everyday. Don't forget in this country we have had an African American tied to a car and drug from one town to another until body parts were seperated, babies thrown out of windows, children molested by their fathers,neighbors and priests, and crazed adults bombing day care centers where little Jewish Children are attending school. The U.S. is no Holier than Pakistan, under Islam or Democracy. When are we all going to open our eyes and ears and learn that only we as individuals can change the history or course of our country by how we perceive, and treat our fellowmen and women. Grow up America, no country is without its woes.If any of us chooses to raise our hands, please let it be in prayer for the Country of Pakistan, and its leaders and not in condemnation. Condemnation is a mirror that reflects two ways.
| By Anonymous on Thursday, October 26, 2000 - 12:45 am: |
Is there anyone could help me ? I fell in love with one pathan man from Peshawar but he was married . I heard that because he had relative marriage so it is impossible for him to have more than one wife or get divorced .Is it true ? I am a very nice one and do not want to be cheated or waste time on someone who I should not love.After reading those those horrible stories of Pakistanian men I was scared. I just feel that I might have fallen into a trap and could not get out . Is there anyone could guide me or tell me anything about pathan marriage in Pakistan ? I really want to know more about the country which is so strange for me .
| By sumon on Sunday, October 29, 2000 - 05:38 pm: |
hi there,
i am a bangladeshi guy. i am in final year in my university, majoring in mechanical engineering. in my opinion , i think there is some spiritual relationship among the people of south asia. in most cases we feel the same way, we have the same social values . i think there should not be any mistrust and misunderstanding among us.
social and marriage among the people of south asia is, i think a great idea.
anyone interested in exchanging ideas with me are welcome to email me at mdsumon@yahoo.com
| By hmmmm on Monday, October 30, 2000 - 06:56 pm: |
hey people.....u guys really must be full of venom to pour out so much of hatred onto this man......i think it would make a lot of difference if everybody jus improves themselves instead of trying to improve others
| By Bandit on Thursday, November 02, 2000 - 11:44 am: |
hi anonymous,
You want to marry a pathan,than you must be a sardar.
| By Anonymous on Thursday, November 02, 2000 - 06:54 pm: |
Hi ,Bandit ,what's the meaning of sardar in English ? Could you please explain to me ? Thanks in advance .
| By Anonymous on Thursday, November 02, 2000 - 08:01 pm: |
Hi, Bandit ,
What's the meaning of Sardar ? Could you please explain it in English ? Thanks .
| By gotta on Saturday, November 04, 2000 - 03:49 am: |
I like to indians.If I meet indians friends I feel good.
| By Flatus Maximus on Monday, November 06, 2000 - 09:12 am: |
Hello. I am in the USA, and a Catholic. The important thing everyone should ask themselves is, who has the power? Can the women you know buy property, vote, divorce freely? Can they keep money? Are they dependent on men for what freedom they have, or can they do as they please without question? Women want their own way more than anything, believe me, a lot more than they want your respect. I remember a huge fuss made about a child murderer in Pakistan who had raped many little boys and destroyed their bodies in acid; (I thought that kind of horror only happened here!) it seems the man had whole barrels of acid hanging around. Then I read about women in Pakistan having acid thrown on them by jealous men, not one of whom has been prosecuted. Perhaps the people who sold that murderer his acid thought he was just going to throw it on a woman.
The disrespect for women even extends to birth; families are encouraging women to abort female fetuses in many Eastern countries. What's going to happen in twenty years? Who will your precious sons marry? They will have to go elsewhere for wives; streets in Asia will look as much a motley as in America. We don't care anymore (at least I don't) but you might.
There is too much hatred everywhere; everyone knows about the crimes commited against American blacks (who were Christian) by American whites (who were also Christian). Love one another, and whatever your religion, reject anything that says otherwise. You'll be happier. Trust each other enough to give freedom; pen up sheep and goats, not your heart's love, not your wife, daughters, and mothers. Everyone you see was once a baby you would pick up and care for if you saw it in the street. Never forget that.
| By Anonymous on Monday, November 13, 2000 - 09:38 pm: |
I think that Pakistani people gave a lot to UK.
| By Arjun Singh Malhotra on Tuesday, November 14, 2000 - 03:13 am: |
What the hell did Pakis give to the UK, except maybe illegals, terrorism ,Hizb, and fried onions. `
| By Anonymous on Thursday, November 16, 2000 - 08:25 pm: |
First of all Pakis have a old culture.
As you know UK parents usually have 2 children
and Pakis have at least 5.
You Hindus and Shiks should stick together with
Pakistans in foreign countries especially in UK.
In that way southasians will increase in population
of UK and it will be a payback for colonialism
and humiliations in the history.
You white English have to understand that Pakistans
had give a lot to UK.Pakis were soldiers,economists
scientists etc.
It is Pakistans right to have their own language
URDU in English schools.
Southasians from north(Baluchistan,Sindh,Punjab,
Kashmir,Patan,Hindustan,Bombay) should stick together
and be proud on their culturale heretige-great mosheas
(in Lahore,New Delhi,Islamabad,Hyderabad etc.)
Pakistan and North India have a great population so
I suggest that a part of that population(about 10
millions-Baluchistans,Sindhs,Punjabies,Kashmires
Hindustans)would be sattled in England(best location
is Somerset or Oxford(for students and intelectuals).
Westeuropean countries need computer engineers so
I think that young and smart students from Pakistan
and North India should apply to UK universities
and UK goverment should built a special town for that
stUDETS(like Japanese have towns where only live doctors who research the new technologies).
I want more southasians from England to apply
to this site.
Greetings
| By Anonymous on Friday, November 17, 2000 - 03:41 pm: |
After reading all the emails on this site, there a few things i would like to say. All those hindhu people who are hinting at some relationship between sikhs and thenselves. You forget the storming of the Golden Temple and the mass killing of Sikhs which followed throughout India by hindhus. More Sikhs were killed during the fight for independence or put in prison during the struggle. They only make up 2% of the population and almost 95% of people arrested or killed were Sikh. Why was that? My father was a british officer in India, that is the main reason for my interest in the region. Muslims may have done all sorts of bad things against the Indians but the Hindhus are not innocent. If it was not for the punjab regiments the india pakisatan wars may have had a different outcome. Even though Sikhs sacraficed more by the way of gudwaras and historical areas during partiction they still do not gain the respect they deserve from both sides.
| By Shamim Ahmed Jitu on Saturday, November 18, 2000 - 10:37 pm: |
I just wanna say that , I hate Pakistan N' Pakistanies. We defeated them in 1971 with the help of indian armies. Thank you India. Pakistanies doing so many crimes on the sake of their religion. But Islam is not so rude or crude as they are showing. Pakistan is in a bad condition now-days. It's GDP is below 3.20. N' they r talking 'bout fighting with india. Huh... Forgot 1971? Recently India decided not to visit Pakistan for cricket tournament. Congrats India. Our honourable Prime Minister Sheikh hasina warned parvez Mosarraf in the UN. Pakistan should be fucked by all.
Shamim Ahmed, Dept. Of Economics, University Of Dhaka.
| By Anonymous on Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 09:01 am: |
Hi Folks You are wasting your time in trying to find
fault with every indian,pakistani,be they muslims or
hindus.The fault lies with the corrupt politicians in
all these countries.these turds exploit the populace with the simple intenetion of gaining and staying in power.power to them is God.and the path to that goal is strewn with exploitation of agendas consisting of fanatical religious fervour.They belong
to the SSS and their corrupt politicians in India,the Thalibans in Afganistan and the mullahs of Paksitan.These folks live likes frogs in a well and have no knowledge ofwhat is happening beyond their
immediate community.They have their henchman who are
ever willing to do their bidding for a meal.
Put this in your pipe and smoke it for sometime.
Just look at your politcians around you.
| By MHCJ....MUSLIM,HINDU,CHRISTIAN,JAIN..... on Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 04:56 pm: |
Be it pakistan or india , we are all humans.
I just pray to "GOD" and ask him to disappear, atleast then we will not have the fight regarding the religion.
| By Iceman on Saturday, November 25, 2000 - 03:48 pm: |
Im a 21yr old from london. and i've read all the opinions posted above. we dont live in a perfect world, and we dont live with perfect people. but take a look at what ur writing...There's alot of angst going on here, and in my opinion, alot of ignorance.
my question is this: why do we insist no generalising and not look at each individual on their merits?
one of my closest friends is a Muslim. he reads his Namaz five times a day without fail, and keeps extra fasts at Ramadan. surly an example of a good Muslim. religion has not been an issue between us in the 16 years that i know him, neither has the issue of the Mughal invasions of India many hundreds of years ago.
another very dear friend of mine is a Sikh. and he truly is someone who can represent to the world as an example of what a Sikh should be. the issues of castes have never been raised between us.
i have another friend who is hindu. he also does his best to be a good hindu and stay within the bounds of his religion. i have never held him or his family responsible for the attack on the Golden Temple.
Now dont get me wrong here. im not claiming to be completley tolerant and completely free of racial/cultural prejudice. i have my personal opinions on alot of the issues discussed above, but the difference is, i try not to generalise. there are good people and bad people in all cultures. it is up to us to identify those who are good, and to respect their boundaries and values.
a classic example of this is the time of the indo/pak partition.His Muslim neighbours, who were the descendents of the Mughals, put themselves in danger to escort my grandfather and the other neighbouring sikh families to the border to offer their protection. when it came to saying goodbye, my grandfather told of how they embraced their former neighbours, who were tearfull to see them go. years later, in 1984, his good hindu neighbours could do little as the Indian government let loose an all out assault on the Golden Temple and other Sikh temples in operation blue star. the aftermath of which saw Sikhs slaughtered and raped all over india.
see the pattern? its the heart, the human being that God values over anything else.
We can all stand there and point the finger. thats easy. how about looking in the mirror and trying to better ourselves? if each of us worked to being the perfect hindu, muslim, sikh,or whatever religion you may follow, we would all be better human beings, and would spend less time slandering entire races and religions.
nobody chooses where they are born, likewise, nobody chooses their religion. if you have any beleif in God, then you will beleive that God is perfect in every way and would never make a mistake. So if God, in his infinite wisdom, chooses that you would be born in any given religious background, then who are we to argue? just get on with ur life and do your best. lifes too short for this.
Look after yourselves and learn to at least tolerate if not respect eash other.
| By Bandit on Thursday, November 30, 2000 - 12:48 am: |
Iceman,
My dear Naive,good human,Iwish life was as you see it,I use to see it in exactly the same way,when i was your age,but as you grow the mist begins to clear and realities set in,now i am 40 and there is no mist i see things as they really are,and your friends are also in the same boat as your self,unfortunately you will age and will see the wall going up.
Since the insception os Islam and Christianity mother Earth has known no peace.You have also not experienced the murder of a loved one by a Religious fanatic or terrorist.I hope you never do.
| By d'nise on Thursday, November 30, 2000 - 08:31 am: |
my god!!!! this is about religion? its sick that so much hatred and anger and venom should come out of religion? when does it stop and who's gonna stop it? to all of you sikhs, muslims, hindus or whatever let me ask you: do you have the courage or will you continue bashing the •••• out of each for another century?
| By Commonsense on Sunday, December 03, 2000 - 08:16 pm: |
it's called peace, even though hindus and muslims have their differences, what's done is done, the religious wars have to stop in order to actually be considered part of the new millenium. Kashmir is battled, why not make the LOC the border?
| By Bandit on Tuesday, December 05, 2000 - 12:04 am: |
Pleeeaaassse!!!!!
Tell all this to the Muslims and Christians,IT IS these two religions that PREACH that SALVATION is through their GOD ONLY.
MUSLIMS and CHRISTIANS are the snake that your prophets talk of,this two headed snake has spewed enough venom,in the last 2000 yrs,that it may take another 2000 to heal.
| By paki girl on Wednesday, December 06, 2000 - 05:03 pm: |
you all get a life and just stop saying bad things about each other.
| By Anonymous on Thursday, December 07, 2000 - 02:34 pm: |
i would like somebody to explain to me why muslims marry close family members. I know a family of muslims and they just got their daughter married to their cousin, why. For me that is just dirty, i treat my cousins as sisters and brothers. Im not saying muslims are this and that but this is one part of their culture thats needs to be explained. Is it written in the religion or something. The anti muslim feeling on this web site i feel stems from one thing. Through out history muslims ahve tried to convert others to islam, without showing tollerence to other religions. This has not been the fault of muslims but of their leaders, so we shouldn't balme all of them for that. Also the whole Kashmir issue. The argument of the Muslims is that the vast population of Kashmir is Muslim, so they should be handed over to Pakistan. If that is the case, then they should also ask for the whole of Bradford from the British government, its wall to wall stani there.
| By US MARSHAL on Sunday, December 10, 2000 - 03:05 pm: |
HI !!!
MY DEAR HINDU FRIENDS COULD SOMEONE COME FORWARD AND EXPLAIN WHAT LINGUM MEANS FOR EXAMPLE : SHIVA LINGUM OR MULLAH'S LINGUM.
USMARSHALL
| By Rajput on Tuesday, December 12, 2000 - 03:12 am: |
to anon
If people hate muslims because they have alledgedly forced people to convert to their religion, then should the sikhs hate the hindus for the 1982 massacres or the christians for the current butchering of their people or the muslims for the forced reconversions back to hinduism. your post is extremely patronising, and is inviting comments of a more crude nature. Another thing inter-marriage is only predominant in the muslims of the indian sub-continent. Infact in Islam it is recommended to marry outside your immediate family. I mean there are stories in india of women being married to animals or forever condemned with marriage to a god/goddess lekin u don't hear muslims lambasting hindus for this. At least r marriages r with humans even though they maybe close relations! Anyhow r u telling me that these types of marriages don't happen in other communities. All the people of the indian sub-continent share a common culture, despite what extremists on all sides would like us to beleive.
As far as Kashmir is concerned read your own history. Even Nehru promised a referedum on the issue. The partision of British India was on the lines of the relgious persuasion of the country. Hence Hindu majority areas went to india and vice versa.
This idea that to fight for your freedom is terrorism is a subjective thing. When the people of india fought the British they were also labelled as terrorists, yet we refer to them as freedom fighters. No person leaves his family, friends and job to get certain death. Only those that feel strongly do so, and these are real men. Look at the odds there are over 500,000 india soldiers with all the military might, yet in ten years the freedom fighters have not been contained.
Please do not think that it bothers me the least that muslims are hated by Hindu's, or some (hindu's)at least. Because the hindu's in the UK are very friendly people, and i wouldn't like to taint all with the same brush.
Regards
Rajput
| By Bandit on Wednesday, December 13, 2000 - 05:02 pm: |
Rajput.
Try fooling someone else,you sullah.Pray that you dont bump it to a Rajput.
Pakistan,Bangladesh and Afghanistan,will all be swallowed up by Mata,Bharat.Concentration camps,for you.
| By Raj on Wednesday, December 13, 2000 - 11:47 pm: |
hahah a rajput mullah. Im of distant rajput descent u little half knob coward, try fooling someone else. Whats with the editor, hes heavily editing my posts, i posted one to apashruthi which is yet to be posted online.
Bandit, hahah that lame net warrior in the race relations is board is something aint she? Btw, whats the news with Raga, did he score with those sullie chicks who work for him?
| By rajput on Friday, December 15, 2000 - 05:56 am: |
At least I've got one. Last I heard u lot were worshipping knobs! Your comments prove that its pointless talking 2 u with intellect and reason. u r of distant rajput descent which in other words means one of my relatives visited the brothel 2 create u. so u r really a kanjar!
Although this discussion board is 4 intellectual debate u bring it down to the gutter. r u suprised u get this response. I am not surprised u r last post was censored u may have actually used u r brain!
regards
| By jatt 2 da core on Friday, December 22, 2000 - 12:29 am: |
to the rajput
hahahahahahaha oye rajput just go and check how rajputs became muslims they just sold their sisters and daughters to mughals in order to save them selves from them and also got converted to islam i have nothing against islam but the way it was forced on to the people like you who were cowards like heck and brought shame to the great rajput heritage and real rajputs are those who either became singhs(lions)or stayed hindus and fought.but those who became muslims were born cowards.
| By Rajput on Friday, December 22, 2000 - 05:51 am: |
To the jat
I am glad u found my post funny. I thught it was time 2 inject some humour.
wasn't the guy who sold Kasmir 2 the british a sikh? Was he a lion too?! If sikhs r lions what happened when they were massacred in the early 80's. + what have hindus done that was so heroic? I mean they preach peace love and harmony. But do their neighbours get that. I don't think its very heroic to massacre minorities! I mean if I bought50 people to kill u - I would be the biggest coward in the world!
Any way u get cowards in every caste and religion. I just pray that everyone tries a little harder 2 get on.
Regards.
| By Raj on Friday, December 22, 2000 - 09:12 am: |
mullah dog, can you hold your own against a tamil or a singh? NO, and y? You half knobs are gutless and guess what, im going to pork one of your mullah girls and convert her to hinduism like all my bros are doing here. Good day sullie, your days are numbered.
| By jatt2dacore on Wednesday, December 27, 2000 - 01:13 am: |
to the rajput
hey rajput just go and check one who sold kashmir to the british was a hindu not a sikh and in ne case it was better then letting it go to the hands of some fundmentalists who themselves never practised islam completely and my advice to you if muslims want peace in world then they have to practice islam completely not in fragments and choosing parts accordong to convinience and you are talkin bout bravery of singhs then go and ask what happened to indira gandhi what happened to the generals of indian army which attacked harmandir sahib what happened to all those goverment official they all were killed inside their houses and you know whathindus would have been wiped out from indian punjab but that would have been the shame on the name of singhs its certainly not ne act bravery to kill weak people.
and i am not to represent hindus i probably like them as much as you do or whatever and mind it even in those 1984 riots they were haryana jats and UP gujjars who did these heinious crimes not rajputs in case you dont know and you know what most of the rioting in delhi was done by illegal migrants from bangladesh and i praise pakistanis for one thing for the way you people treated these bangladeshi pigs they deserved to be treated like that they dont have any guts tofight all they can do is that they can only backstab.
.and one morething dont use this minoroity thingy though i my self am from minority and i hate being in india but not all the minorities in india are same in india so much o f special status has been given to muslims and so much of protection with privelages like reservtion in jobs but still theykeep on supporting pakistan so we cant put all the minorities as same.
but my freinds fact remains you people converted to islam by fear not by choice.
i think i explained you enough ill be glad to recieve any reply from you.
| By Rajput on Friday, December 29, 2000 - 12:30 am: |
To the Jatt2thecore,
The guy who sold Kasmir to the british had singh at the end of his name. I did not know that this applied to hindus as well.
My point in essence was that there are brave and coward people in all religions and castes.
Regarding conversion by fear or force then I am sure u r aware that the Sikhs were Hindus b4. It does not necessarily mean that u were forced 2become a sikh.
I am sure u r also aware of the great and vast history of Sufi saints in India. At the hands of these people there were millions who became muslim. My family itself is from jallander in Indian punjab.
it is quite obvious that if you convert through fear u will not practice your religion in private and the religion will not last through generations. Yet Islam has been present for centuries in India. India is host to one of the largest populations of muslims in the world. I am sure that there is no fear for them to remain muslims. So if they wished they could become hindus again. If they so choose. Yet think about it in the last few centuries most of the great islamic scholars have hailed from south asia. SO I think this allegation that hindus converted to Islam out of fear is one of those exercises in re-writing history by the •••• Sena or people like them. Plus it does not show hindus to be very brave people if they can leave their religion so easily. So I think u should give credit to intellect as well.
As far as the massacres of sikhs in 1980s is concerned it was only an example of how all communities have been targeted. Incidentally do u know that the first communal riot in India was in the begining of the 20th Century. It shows that under the muslim rule it was a lot more peaceful than under british rule. Even jews admit to their best time being under islamic rule in 13th century andalusia.
I do not know how many rights muslims have in india -i.e. whether they do get guaranteed jobs - because if u look atthe facts it is muslims who have suffered heavily in the last 10-15 yrs. I mean recently mr thackry is saying he wants to take the vote away from muslims. I think he should stick to drawing cartoons!
Ok yaar this post is getting too long!
regards
| By jatt2dacore on Sunday, December 31, 2000 - 01:30 am: |
to the RAJPUT
hey man what you never knew that hindus also put singh as their middle name(thats different they dont mean it if)but what kind of rajput are you if you dont know that rajputs always had singh as their middle name and the guy who in your words sold kashmir was neither a singh(sikh) nor a rajput(a true rajput with what i mean hindu rajput from rajasthan and western UP)he was a dogra hindu in case you dont know.
and you wanted me to tell you how hindus became muslims since you have forced me to explain and as i didnt wanted to hurt you first and i dont mean now as well but let me tell you the truth what happened.and please keep in mind that i dont hate islam as it will be against sikhi if i hate any religion in world.so listen in india hindus became muslim because of the muslim raiders who in the name of jehad did all the worst possible things to the local people and the worst thing they did was that they raped the local women by abducting them and then they made it sure that the children hence born should be made muslims with all the madrasas they opened there minds where white washed by the mullahs in the madrasas and the new generation was totally with muslim mindset.
and you are right we didnt had hindu muslim riots as hindus were not strong enough to fight and all we had where hindu massacares and if you say that muslim rulers never did nethin then how do you explain the demolition of ayodhya temple by babar and how do you explain the demolition of thousands of hindu temple in deccan by aurangzeb and tipu sultaan?and look at singhs you wanna know the difference then the difference is we also fought with you and we were always minutismal in number if compared with the muslim army but we always gave you great fight and most of the time we won and you wanna know why we won because we always respected women we in eastern punjab just killed all the male muslim population but never did a thing to muslim women and they were handed over to the neighbouring muslim ruled areas and this was the gift given to us by our tenth guru and he ordered us never to have any sexual contact with ne muslim female unless she is converted to ANY other religion so that we are not blamed for using sex to convert people this is the difference and even now sikh can not marry any muslim girl unless she is converted to any other religion of her choice but islam and those who do marry or talk bout marrying someone or using some kind of relationship for conversion can not be termed as sikh.
and one more thing in case you dont know we didnt converted to sikhism because of fear as there was nothing which could convert us to sikhi with force we converted to save weaker people like hindus and the recently converted muslims who were converted by force and you know what there was a substantial percentage of muslims as well who converted and became sikh they were those muslims who had recently converted to islam i mean the first generation muslims.
and you talk bout muslims living in india then just compare the per capita income of a muslim in india to the percapita income of muslim in pakistan then only you will know the difference and guess what if muslims were so much underpressure and were being murdered then how come their population rise like hell in india and if you compare it with hindu population in pakistan then only you will understand.
hindu population in pakistan just dropped and dropped.this is the difference my freind between india and pakistan we have the guts to make a muslim the president of our country he can be the top most nuclear scientist in india(apj abul kalaam)but can you show simmilar things with hindus or sikhs in pakistan all they can become is some politician small time politician that too just to show that pakistan respects minorities.
my freind tell me which islamic country can even compare it self by the kind of sceintific development shown by india no noway and look i am the one which supports khalistan but theses are simple facts which show something.
so my freind just think bout these things and i would love to answer any further question from you
| By Rajput on Sunday, December 31, 2000 - 10:11 pm: |
jatt 2 da core
Yaar u totally misunderstand my posts. I never say muslim rulers were not corrupt - many were. But there were good ones as well. When the British invaded india- India was the 3rd most advanced nation. What did the british leave behind. In the words of Churchill a nation of uncivilized apes!
the treatment of minorities in Pakistan is not as bad as u make out. Have u ever been to pakistan? I don't know about hindus because they live in sindh but the sikhs live in punjab and because I am from lahore I c and meet many and have made many good friends. They never complain about any problems. I even see them go to nankana sahib in their thousands. Never is there any problem.
U say u have muslim scientists and presidents. it is muslim scientist who build india's nuclear bomb. Yet r u telling me muslims get good treatment in india? No chance. I know many indians who live in the UK and there are always saying that there is fighting in their villages between hindus and muslims.
In Islam it is haraam to knock down any place of worship whether temple or church. Indeed in the quran it is obligatory to declare jihad for the defence of any place of worship.So if anybody knock any place down he is comtting a grave sin.
Do u deny that in India hundreds of thousands became muslims at the hands of sufi saints?
As far as muslim countries are concerned u will find thousands of hindus in the arab world working to earn a living, which they send back to india.
During partition there were many muslims who escorted sikhs to indian punjab and there were many honourable sikhs who escorted muslims to Pakistan punjab. But there were also bad people on both sides. Lekin it is better if we remember the good people if we want peace!
I honestly did not know hindus also call them singhs because I thought it a title for only sikhs but thank u for telling me. 4 me being from rajput family is only accident of birth, but I thank Allah for giving me good blood. However it does not mean I am better than anybody else. Only those who do good are better.
Tipu Sultan was not a bad man he was one of the last defenders against the british. Only 2 be betrayed by a sell-out muslim (jafar).
The reason muslims can never be on good ties with hindus is because their religion is totally different to ours hence sometimes we forget what our religion tells us and commit gustakhiya! Lekin hindus have done enough to us as well. But there is no compulsion in deen (ideology) as the quran tells us and so if people want to go back to Hinduism they are more than welcome. It is their choice. I do not think many will take this option though. We muslims in Pakistan are not the best at practising Islam because we did not recieve it via a state i.e. khilafat but got it from people (saints) hence are comprehension is a little weak. Lekin I do not think there are another nation in this world who loves Islam so much. And I think in our hearts we are more than prepared to sacrifice our lives for the sake of our honour and for God.
Regards
| By jatt2dacore on Tuesday, January 02, 2001 - 11:43 pm: |
to the rajput
i must say yaar your post was really very impressive and i liked it but there are few things that i wanna tell you it is true that apj abul kalaam is a great scientist but the fact is that indias nuclear bomb was developed by the scientist m chidambram and apj abul kalaam sahib is takin good care of the team he is just the head of the team and this is all because he got the opertunity to get there as we trust in our own people once they are citizen they are citizen and they share the equal right but in the case of muslims may be more.but can you show any of these achievements shown by a hindu or a sikh from pakistan no why because they are nevr given opertunity and if you wanna compare scientifically then just which is country which is the country which tops in software and tgenetics research and also india is also among the leading countries in biotech and agricultural research which other muslim country can show this kind scientific growth i bet no one can.why talk bout any other country lets take pakistan can pakistan show this kind of scientific and economic growth like india no why?you aloso got the freedom the same time as ours you had less people to manage you always had US backing you up then why couldnt you develop do you have any reason for that?
ok you find very many hindu in middle eastern countries so what you find so many muslims in india coming from bangladesh and northern srilanka and malaysia my freind here it is nothing to do with religion it all depends on hunger you run there where you find the food.and i know it is haraam in islam to bring down any place of worship thats why my freind in my other post also i said muslims should learn to practice islam completely that is if they want peace in the world.
and ya i agree tipu sultaan fought against british but he was the pioneer in destroying hindu temples in south india and these indians also project him as a national hero just to show there secular aspect but they are also bluffing they only show one side of the story.get to south india and see how he is being cursed.
and one more thing i wanted to tell you is that my family came from peshawar at the time of partition and what all happened there is nothing to be proud of by pathans they have always shown the biggest betrayelsfirst to the sikhs at the time of partition then to kashmiri muslims i have a frien here in US he is a kashmiri from indian side of kashmir and he wants seperate kashmir but he never wants it to merge with pakistan as he said in 1947-48 war these pathans instead of liberating kashmir started looting kashmiris themselves and if you say that muslims in kashmir are very simple then let me tell you that my mom is a kashmiri hindu and my uncle and all tell me how they were forced out kashmir valley and how the temples were burned so man if bringing down any place of worship is haraam then i think kashmiri muslims have commited this sin and hence they have betrayed islam itself what do you say?
and ya you said that muslims hate hindus because there religion is totally different from yours but why the hell should it matter its different its different but why should it bothers you if according to you they are following the correct path then its there problem but why should you care.i mean i dont care bout religions and no one does.
ok freind let me tell you a real story that happened with me that i have some pakistani freinds most of them are from lahore or jhelum and there is one guy whome i saved my self from not eating pork and you know in return what he did he disgraced my religion in front of people look how he paid back this is the difference man and all for a girl who just happens to be a sikh how disgusting it gets.
and you were saying bout treatment being met to minorities there in pakistan then listen freind i have another freind and he is from nankana sahib and he him self excepted that sikhs dont let there daughters out coz of this fear from muslims over there and he him self addmitted of behaving indecently with some sikh girls so what do you have to say about that my freinds things arent such simple as they seem they are lot complicated.
i think i made my point clear and if you have any more things to say please write again i enjoy your posts
| By Rajput on Wednesday, January 03, 2001 - 05:37 am: |
to the Jatt2dacore
Yaar all I can say history like life is subjective. Ur viewpoint depends on where u are looking from. 1 person thinks homosexuality is wrong another thinks it is ok! Same hindus think muslim did wrong and muslim think hindus did wrong.
As far as the Kashmir valley is concerned I know it is a big problem. But the way I see it is that every place the British left they always left one problem behind. For example Turkey and Syria dispute over water, turkey and Iraq over Kurds, Iraq and Kuwait over kuwait etc.
Nevertheless even Nehru did say that he would hold a referendum. If India was divided because of religion then surely Kashmir should have gone to Pakistan, then no one would have disputed anything. There would have been no problems between india and Pakistan and possibly they could have once again joined a federation.
Yaar about the nuclear bomb thing all I can say is that both countries find it hard 2 feed their people so its a bit silly. But it is problems such as the above that caused the tension.
Regarding Hindus and Sikhs in Pakistan I am sure if there are problems 4 them then they would leave 4 india. But u know as well as i do that it is not all very easy 4 muslims in India as well. In todays India no matter how good person u r or citizen u r still looked with suspicion if u r not hindu.
Regarding scientific advancement of muslim countries, I agree wholeheartedly that India is more advance and this is a shame for us. With regards to Pakistan it is because we are better at fighting than studying !!
Lekin if u look at history u will see that there are many muslim scientist who lay the foundation of modern science, for example ibn ruus (avirus) and Ibn Sina (avi sinnus). So we r not completely thick!
About Paak relationship with US - I also think its foolish. America is a capitalist country and will make relations with whoever suits its interest at the time. Lord Palmerston said that Britain had no eternal friends but eternal interests". This is what modern capitalist country work on. For example the mujahideen in Afghanistan were once "freedom fighter" now they r terrorists!
About sikh girls and pakistani boys - I think its only because we share same language and culture that sikh girls go out with Pakistani boys. I studied in Birmingham university which has large population of sikhs so I see with my own eyes. But it is not that sikh girls are forced or there is some secret plan. I remember about 4 yrs ago a letter was distributed in sikh temples asking muslims to convert sikh girls. But u know it did not cause much trouble because the sikhs realised it was written by someone who wanted to cause friction between the 2 communties. Because if I wrote the letter I would obviously send it to mosques and try to keep it a secret so sikh girls were not aware of anything!!
I am not saying that everything is ok because we have problems. Some r naturally going to stay because of our history. There will always be sikhs who hate muslims and vice versa! This is because both communities are hot blooded people and fight first and think later!!
Yaar about hindus u misunderstood. I meant that muslims of asia sometimes have done wrong against hindus because of simply not understanding their religion. It is totally different from ours. Lekin I know it is wrong to fight some one for simply for religious reasons. Our Prophet (PBUH) said that he who harmed a dhimmi (i.e. non muslim citizen of khilafat) for just being a non-muslim then he harmed him and he who harmed him harmed God.
So as a muslim I do not hate somone for their religion. In this life we create our own Jannat and Jahannam.
About your last comment about nanakana - yaar there are always idiots. I swear to 2 that even though I was asked many times by sikh girls for dates I nver once touched one because I beleive in honour. If I am not going to marry someone then I will not touch them.
All the best
| By a hinhu on Wednesday, January 03, 2001 - 08:57 am: |
why do you use the name rajput. rajputs were staunch hindus. are there rajputs who had to convert to muslim religion ? in pakistan? how much of the paki militiary is made up of people with hindus ancestary like the rajpust , jats , gujjars? etc.
| By jatt2dacore on Wednesday, January 03, 2001 - 10:17 pm: |
to the rajput
hey man this time you missunderstood me i never said that there is something in muslims marrying hindus and sikhs but my point was very much different i meant you should not go looking for them and should not force them and this what one of my pakistani freinds told me is happeneing in pakistan they are being abducted.and what you said that you are good at fighting and indians are good at using brains then in case you dont know then indians have people who can fight equally well aswell and the thing is you dont find those indians outside india and what impression of indians you get is of all these south indians and gujjus buti tell you once you see some haryana jats(they are different from punjabi jatts)and UP gujjars they are equally leathal and have been fighting and how can you forget singhs and rajputs from india they dont have any comparison as sikh regiment won the most number of medals even in the world war two with the british india army and what bout rajputana regiment they are also unstoppable.and very rarely do you see.jat regiment and that is because they are very barbaric and commit most human rights violations and they are responsible for the situation to worse in kashmir as they commit barbaric activities and one point for sure that kashmir valley should separate from india but why should it go with pakistan why cant it be separate and one more thing kashmiri hindus should also be allowed to get back to kashmir with all there property given back to them.
yaar as you said that if hindus and sikhs are facing problem then they would leave for india same way i can also say that if muslims are facing problems in india then they will leave for pakistan what do you have to say bout that.and for your information we are recieving hinus from pakistani punjab so things inpakistan are not very pleasent in pakistan and you are always evading this question of mine that can you show achievments by hindus and sikhs in pakistan?
and you said that both the countries are facing difficulties in feeding its own people but the situation in india is really different as in india it all depends on the state and some states are really rich and some are poor and all we need to do is develop those undeveloped states and let me tell you that indian punjab is a kind of state which will be a developed country once it gets independence and it has always been termed as the developed state in an underdeveloped country.and now we have maharashtra also joining the same ranks we have kerala with 100%literacy with andhra pradesh and karanataka becoming the hubb ofsoftware export in world,haryana the most self sufficient state in himachal the best place to stay in asia so the situation is not that bad in india as compared to pakistan and can you show us even a single city like bombay,gurgaon,new delhi ,chandigarh,bangalore,poona,vizag or even hyderabad which holds 40%muslim population?so what do you have to say bout that?
and hey why should we talk bout hindus and sikhs in pakistan just look at the shia muslims only you have problems with them though i totally disagree with there concept as in our granthsahib also it is written that muhammed was the last prophet in this yug but that a different story but the fact remains you dont want any one else but sunni muslims in pakistan and look at us singhs and our concept of khalistan it will be country for both sikhs and hindus as long as they are punjabis.
so my freind there can not be any comparison between two countries who got independence