Is an Arranged LOVE Marriage More Successful?
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Is an Arranged LOVE Marriage More Successful?
Is an Arranged LOVE Marriage More Successful?
Sounds paradoxical BUT it is happening.
The neo-trend in Indian communities worldwide and to some extent in contemporary India, is to 'date or 'falling in love' (still do not understand what is FALLING in love...love sounds like some kind of pond where you slip your foot and fall:) well probably yes figuratively or literally you do fall...dont you...well since love is supposed to be blindish or atleast one eyed [if it is not bi-lateral i guess] you are bound to fall so let us give up).
Once you are blinded or glared by the lightening of love and fall in the deep pond of love, you either sink and wait for the rescue and if you are alert and smart you probably end up marrying. Hence my concept of arranged love marriage was born.
One find day, i was struck by the lightening and fell in pond, blinded i couldnt see much so one can imagine. But another fine day when i opened my eyes i just ran to the surface and thus i was single again. This is a mini short story.
Cut the roll and coming back to the topic, arranged love marriage or non-traditional arranged marriage - IS not as modern or new phenomenon as it does sound but this hybrid of love affair and arranged marriage has more future in extra conservative and traditional families of India.
Love affairs were and are frowned upon by elders for the fear of a possible fracas; but if you fall in love with someone 'acceptable' by your family; the chances of their support are brighter.
Before we go on giving sermons let us think and see what possibilities this modified version of arranged marriage has? What do YOU think? Anyone with experience!
Dear Raymond,
i think you are doing the right thing, think of yourself now, and your future. don't dwell on this and do your best to move on. life's too short to be unhappy. you have to believe yourself you are doing the right thing, even if it's your only choice.
best of luck
Dear Miss Amrika,
Thanks a lot for your support.
But you know, no matter how much support and advice I get, it still hurts.
Actually it's hurting only more when I think how everything went & why everything is happening.
For example my ex-grilfriends parents and especially the mother: she KNEW that we love eachother.........Knowing that if she will ask, bother, fight, forcing and playing "sad" scenes in front of my ex-girlfriend to marry an Indian, she will give in at the end. And that's what excatly happend: my ex-girlfriend just felt sick and disgusted at the end.
And believe me that hurts: to see your love being tortured and break down like this.
2nd: the moment her mother weakend my ex-girlfriend, she slowly fell into her mother's "power". After my ex-girlfriend just got 1 call from her future-husband, she had to tell him that she "wants" to marry him?!?! He himself was surprised...
Force, power & demands of the parents......disgusting.
Immediatly after returning from the US (yes: they visited him right after my ex-grilfriend had to promise to marry him) the mother left for India, I'm talking about 2 days after returning from the US!!!
Her parents immediatly took the opportunity to get everything fixed, so that it couldn't be canceled anymore......they were soooo happy.
Cloths for him in the States, cloths for her from India, the wedding place, the invitations, etc., etc.......
everything had to be arranged as soon as possible, quick, quick.
They could never.....NEVER do all this for me?......
if it was me who married their daughter?......... that hurts too thinking about it.
"Let's get everything fixed and arranged, so there is no possible way for her to say "NO" anymore. Because there is no bigger shame then to break a wedding-promise in the Indian-Bengali "culture".......that's how evil her parents think and desire things.
Isn't it disgusting and unfair towards the boy too? But what can, may or should I say...........
The parents HAD to seperate us, that was their one and only goal.........they don't see the hurt and pain in their daughter's eyes.
My girlfriend tries to explain me this.....why she couldn't take the fighting, struggling and complaining from her parents anymore.........she just completely had it. She just saw no other way out...
Going abroad is a good opportunity for her to get away from her parents, that's what she said and still says.
But she cannot stay alone is what she also says......not that far and all alone.........
She says that her parents won't rest untill she's married according their demands. They would always follow her. So even this was not possible.
Bottom line, and this is a very hard conclusion,: everything together led to this awfull, miserable decision.
She really wanted to go far away from her parents, to finish her study and to come to her senses, and later on we (she & I) would be together..........that is still her wish.
Another idea she had was that she would go first, and some time later (not too long) I would. But her parents would come to know about this and everything would start over again. "What do I do Asfar" she cried so many time...........she cried so many times........
Nothing is more painfull in this world than not being able to be with the one you love.........
Death is better...........cause the person is simply not there anymore, and at peace............but knowing that your love is somewhere in this world, unhappy and thinking and longing for you the rest of your life......but you cannot be in eachothers arms...........there are just no words to describe that pain......
And you know dear Amrika: other problems are yet to start for her. She knows that her marriage is gonna be a disaster because it's fake. It's a lie, an excuse for something else..........
How much that poor girl is going through man !!!
I'm tired.........continue another time oke?
Raymond what does the nl stand for in your email ?
if you love her that much fight for her make her parents love you by being whatever the other guy has and then they wont have an excuse to reject you.
hey but doesnt "Everybody loves Raymond" saying something ?? if they have a show about it im sure it'll work out for you too bud - so dont lose her if she means anything at all to you.
concerned,
if you read the earlier messages raymond has been trying to do everything her parents want. but nothing will ever be good enuf cause he is not the same religion. the only thing to say at this point is how sad the situation is and be supportive, not give him false hope.
raymond,
i do understand how deeply hurt you are. her parents are very selfish and unfair and don't really care for their daughter the way we find acceptable. they think they are doing a great job by sending her for a better life in US, but you are right. there will be more prob for her esp. if she still thinks that you can follow her after marriage etc. how long will her mother be in india? will you continue to see your ex girl up until July or are you thinking of moving on yourself if all your efforts have not been working? maybe it is time for you to be selfish, the pain will be immense but there is light at the end of the tunnel. even if you cannot see it right now.
take care of YOURSELF!!
Dear concerned,
The nl stands for the Netherlands, I live in Holland.
"make her parents love you by being whatever the other guy has" you advised.
My ex-girlfriend's mother told her that she (the mother) knows that I (Asfar) loves her (my ex-gilrfriend) to death and that no one else will ever love her so much as I do.
Still her parents decided different according the marriage.
So tell me dear concerned: what's there to say more.......it's crystal clear that their daughter's
happiness isn't their primary goal or concern.
Please do reply...............
Hi everyone,
I just have no words for your support & concern.............the comfort is immense........
Thank you all...............
Of course I won't stop posting my opinions & experiences
Dear Amrika: like you asked, her mother will return coming saturday (the 18th of nov.).
We would love to stay in contact, but.........you'll know the rest. As of saturday it's better not to.........but I know we will. Very rarely but we will.
Also we're quite disgusted of acting behind people's back or sneakly meeting. 24 & 28 are not ages to behave like kids anymore......besides all the tension that comes along with that.
But still she needs me, also for all the questions she still has for the future.
Today she asked me a question on which I never thought about earlier, because I'm simply not an indian woman. Probably you already guess it. It's sounds very superficial, but I hope there are some indian women who can answer me that question for me: what she has to answer him on the wedding-night if he comes to know that etc., etc., etc.
I hope you all don't mind me asking this question.......but I honestly don't know if she has to tell the truth or not: the consequence CAN be so severe she said............
We both think she shouldn't, what about you all?
have you guys had sex in the 4 years that you knew each other and is that what youre worried about her future husband finding out since she has to be a virgin in these arranged marriage things ?
Dear Anon,
Yes, that's exactly the point. 1 comment if you don't mind: I like to call it "making love".
Having sex is so little, cold and meaningless.
But whatever it's called, my ex-girlfriends is very scared for the consequences if she DOES tell the truth, and on the other hand is will feel very low/guilty if she DOESN'T tell the truth.
What do you all think?
THAT'S IT!!!!!
YOU HAVE ANY INFORMATION ABOUT THAT SO CALLED FUTURE YANKIE GROOM? MAN HE SHOULD KNOW THE FULL TRUTH
I'M ASKING KADIR.
BETTER, I MAIL YOU STRAIGHT AWAY
Dear Desi,
I know that some people can become very furious reading and understanding the content of my postings.
I also can imagine that you're tempted to tell the "whole world" the truth....to open up....to be straight.
But understand 1 thing for sure: if the marriage won't work out (and listening to her thoughts & expectations it won't, but.....), my ex-girlfriend is caught up in Holland, her father will make her life a worse hell than it already is and she never can come out of this misery.
I know it sounds quite unbelievable or careless (specially beacause it's ME saying this) when I tell you that she has to make herself believe that she loves the boy, she has to make herself believe that the marriage will work out for the time being, she has to make herself believe that there will be a brighter day........she has to stay in this "dream", just to get out of this country and to be far away from her parents.............
Her parents force her every single day to be in contact with him (he doesn't know this forceable "faking"), she herself gets sick of the telephone calls at 03:00 a.m. from him (not all the conversations and also not the "companionship"/understanding from him nor him as a person/friend) but the sleepless nights over & over again.
In other words once again: she has to, she is forced to think that there is "love" in the air.......there is just no other way out......I feel very sorry for both of them........she has to think according her parents demands........
So Desi, please do understand, it's not that I don't trust you, but it's too dangerous...........too dangerous to explore it outside this wonderful site.
Tomorrow her mother is coming back, so my last precious moments with her are very less. Today we're going to get the last things from her student room back.........after that there's almost nothing left (listen to "against all odds" by Phil Collins: every word in this song reflects our story).
Holding eachother tight...........torn apart from eachother.......but still the enormous energy when we touch.........it's only once in a lifetime......
Dear everyone,
What I dicovered yesterday will undo my previous postings, those as of Tuesday, October 17, 2000.
Unfornunatly I absolutely cannot talk about it, because it's too inhuman.
I'm closing this chapter of my life for once and for all and begin with a new start.
Fam. Banerjee/Chakraborthy...............watchout for them !!!!!
Take care you guys..........
Dear Raymond,
I'm sorry for all the pain you've been thru and it sounds like something new has come up to add to all of it. My opinion stands the same: move on, do the best you can to repair the damage to yourself and try not to be dragged back in at a later point. She may call you from US saying how unhappy she is etc...
For now my policy is not to tell the "Yankie" about her non-viginity status. Men do not always know, even a doctor examining a patient cannot always tell for sure. It is dishonest, which i believe is WRONG, but the fact she is marrying him out of duty is just as dishonest. the guy prob. is falling for her, 3am calls and all that. so she has to decide for herself how she wants to start off things with a man she does not love and see how he takes it either way. but i agree with both of you, it may just cause more probs. to be honest with him at this point.
Dear Missy Amrika,
Thanks for everything...............is all I can say.
I had to "sell" myself for our sake.................................the lowest of lowest deed.
But I did it for her, and with her...........together............I had to do it, cause me myself concluded something wrong I realise NOW, though I couldn't conclude different with the information I knew THEN !!!!!
People think I'm a psycho now..................but I don't care: she knows what I know and opposite..............that's the only thing that counts.
People just don't know to keep things to themselves...................if they only knew how dangerous and fragile this whole case is...................one day they'll regret what they didn't want to know now.....................she'll be send on a mission...........................for her gateway to freedom...............
Raymond,
What exactly are you saying, it is difficult to read in between the lines of what you wrote. How did you "sell yourself" to the lowest deed? Who thinks you are a psycho? You are talking in riddles...are you both in a safe place right now, that should be your main concern from the things you said about her dad before. It is a little worrisome that you don't care what anyone thinks of you, that shows desperation from all that you have endured. But you still have to try and think with rational mind, don't regret what you do; it will last a lifetime. Make sure she is safe and also that you and she make any big decisions together; you also do not want her to ever look back in regret. Who are you talking to that "don't know to keep things to themselves"? People who appear to be on your side can be going behind your back to sabotage you...is she still going to US to marry right now? Let us know how you are doing.
Raymond i think you just confused me with that last one ............... ??
Desi,
do you and kadir know each other outside of this site? i was just curious, do you live in holland too?
Dear Amrika,
I shouldn't write so much I think, anymore.......
One day the most important people (actually 1) in this case will get to know the truth...........when it's too late. They just misused my trust, didn't want to listen in the first place so this is the price they have to pay now..............for now it's better to lie, deny and to play this awfull game
(this big terrible lie) along..........she asked me............
Please, don't get me wrong: all of you are nowhere to blame !!!!!....... did nothing wrong........
Desi, I never did reply the "other" Desi........he/she would have messed up things more for me..........
This is my first time here. Interesting topic. i must say Raymond ive been reading from the start of this board but you lost me with the last few things you wrote up it was confusing - or is it meant to be a riddle or something ? just wondering.
Dear Yasmeen and others,
I can understand the confusion.
First of all: he, the future husband, knows about this site! That's why I cannot be that "clear" about things I want to say and write anymore.
The second thing is that my ex asked me to write an email to him to "correct" things, to lie...for her sake. It sounds stupid, but I did it, to save her from more misery for the time being.
But on the other hand I felt an awfull kind of egoism too, and that's what keeps me busy in my mind since approx. a week now.
Still, to save her, I bought her a ticket to the States to talk to him in person. She'll leave on the 14th of dec. and be back on the 20th. Sounds unbelievable, but it's nothing more then the truth.
All this I can and must write, even if "he" can read it now. The problem now is that I have so much to say to him, but he misused my trust. Through my ex he asked about me, and that's something he just shouldn't have done..........never.
They're planning now to get the law-marriage preponed: in december. Good, cause after this marriage I'll send him the things he has the right to know of. I'll feel quite bad for him too, I honestly do, cause he just didn't and still doesn't realise how complex this case is and with what kind of history. He just doesn't know what he's getting into. He now thinks I'm just a psycho (like I wrote before) who's just flipping in his head (cause in the email I had to send to him I just had to "sell" myself). But you all don't know how she cried and asked me to write a lie.........for her sake. That's the •••• when you're too much in love: doing things unconditionally and no matter what the price is.
Reading this I hope he'll be silent about it, let him listen to her story when she's there......and if she's gonna tell (a part) of the truth.
To answer your question Yasmeen: a riddle wouldn't be a riddle if it doesn't take some deep brain-thinking........isn't it? But every riddle has an answer, has a solution.........that's the bottom line too isn't it.
People involved in this case just don't think deep enough.......till now at least...........
I have lots of facts to give him, but I'll wait after the marriage, cause on both sides (she and him)I "smell" a bit of disbelieve, a bit of egoism.........I know for sure that it's gonna be another case, but I won't be there for both of them.......I'm stepping out, for me turning back is absolutely impossible......but that's the price they wanted to pay THEMSELVES.........and prob. again "they" cannot just read, listen and keep it to themselves after reading this.
I just looked at where I am now, lost in every aspect of my existence.............at the moment, but I'll crawl back..........
Reading my own postings, I realise that trough time I partially forgot the purpose of this "newsgroup" and went a bit beyond this: "Is an Arranged LOVE Marriage More Successful?".
Tell me people: what the hell is arranged marriage about............cause it seems nothing to do with love......and there is nothing like arranged love !! It’s only lies, lies, lies and healing, fixing, reparing with other lies and lies and lies.
Marrying is only signing papers (as simple as it sounds..........), but love? hapiness?, care?. You can't arrange those things.........that has to grow in time (if it will come at all), when you know how your other half, your significant other is as a human being, as a partner, as a husband or a wife.
Concerning me, that's how it should go: first the love between 2 people, then the 2 can decide to marry.
And especially that love part: how is it possible in a few days of seeing eachother and even hours and days of talking on the telephone?
Seeing if love will be there after the marriage is done, is a HUGE "gamble"............but that's how I think, no matter how sincerly someone says that there is already “love”. "Let's see how it'll work out" is not the way people.....it isn't.....believe me...it isn't......
For everyone love has a different meaning, a different importance.
To me it means the most, because without love, seen from every aspect of it, you’re lost in this world.
The most difficult thing for me as an example: my happiness and my faith is completely lost......lost, because I’ve seen and felt what loving someone sincerely from the heart brought for me, and I don’t like it one bit !......peace in my life is the only hope I have now.
what did your ex ask you to lie about ? and give everyone involved a name so that its easier to know who you're referring to.
Dear Raymond,
I feel very bad for your situation, it seems to go from bad to worse each time you post a message. What in the world possessed you to buy your ex a ticket to go see her fiance?!? Ok, her crying led you to send the Yankee a dishonest email, but where the heck is your selfesteem and self respect?? Men do crazy things for women but at some point you have to gather yourself up and NOT get dragged back into this nightmare over and over!! If she is truly your ex then let her go in your heart; much easier said than done I know, but is this how you want to live right now?? Hanging on in desperation when you KNOW it's over. You are calling her your ex yourself, when will u give up?
As for the Yankee asking about you, he has EVERY RIGHT to do that! You are so wrong there; if you were in his position, wouldn't you ask and want the TRUTH about your fiance's past??!! And YOU yourself got in deeper by sending him that email, take responsibility for your actions also! You could have listened to her cry and go on and find it in your heart-say NO, I feel sorry for you but I have to move on with MY life. Get your head on straight Kadir, you are losing it! Also, your statement "after this marriage I'll send him the things he has the right to know of." If you want to DESTROY any chance for her happiness, then go right ahead. But if you are a truly honorable man and respect her and yourself you will LET IT GO!!!! Also, it is HER duty to tell him how "complex" the case is if she wants to, not YOU!! Who exactly are you in her life after her marriage?!! ONLY the ex-boyfriend who has NO claims and NO rights to get involved at ANY point in time. NONE!!!!!!!! Give up your anger and bitterness and let her go!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am VERY disturbed by what you have said in your last 2 postings. My opinion is if he beats her or verbally abuses her then you can step in but anything else in her life goes on, you need to leave them ALONE!!!!!!!!!! Go find another person who can fully give herself to you and you alone with no reservation.
You need to look at this from her point of view, she cannot/will not stand up to her parents for supposedly the most important person in her life-YOU so why the hell should you continue to suffer????? Are you so demented that you can't see you have been HAD in every sense; you have been taken advantage of and now have to live with the consequences. She is not there for you, she is continually asking you to clean up her mess of a life. Get a clue. Whether her "arranged marriage" does or does not evolve into love and lifelong relations is up to kismet so butt out of it now. They have decided to do the law marriage you say now in dec so they probably are on to you and her reluctance to get stuck in this situation. All that means that you will be out of it all even sooner, wake up and smell the stink of being the "other one". It is not an easy place to be, but make something out of the next 28 years to be proud of, and make your mother proud of your honorable life. Let all your educated siblings be proud of you and stand up like the man that you know you are. Sorry for all the harsh words, I felt the need to tell you like it is at this point in time because you are deluding yourself!!
Dear Miss Amrika,
You're absolutely right, I cannot deny that.
But, she wants to tell the full truth to him now...............but you also you know how Indian men are or become after telling the truth: he'll DEFINITLY back off. No matter how much of faith you have in the person. Cause it would be too much for ANYONE to hear the true "reason" of this marriage.
I'll back off for sure, cause I have a very source aftertaste in my mouth of this case.......
But I cannot rest until she's married, save & sound and far away from her parents.
If I have to lie and to "deny" my ownself to achieve this, I will.................
Because this marriage is indirectly related to my peace...........as wicked as it may sound !!!!! and that's choosing for only myself........
ps: you don't have to be sorry for using harsh words........because I didn't read any.
Raymond
ok since im fairly new here i may not be entirely clear about some things so please forgive me. My heart goes out to you but i just wanted to ask you a couple of things so bear with me. Have you guys actually broken up like gone through the "breaking up talk" and are not speaking to each other or are you 'just friends' for the time being since you keep calling her your "ex" ? And i think you said you've been together for something like 3-4 years (correct ? )and im assuming that in that period of time you would have said of your feelings for each other and somewhere during that time also told the parents that ? i cant imagine the two of you being in love, and the parents having already met you, and furthermore know you and your family and still not approve ? have you ever found out exactly why they dont approve of you have you actually asked them or discussed this seriously ? - you mentioned that they wanted someone with education but you also say that you're a computer engineer and have a law degree i mean if thats not educated im not sure exactly what is ???? And i salute you getting 2 degrees it must have meant a hard slog at college boy do i know but you did it nonetheless.Thats great so congratulations !! Are they worried that you cant financially support yourself and or your wife ? Is there something else that they dont approve of are they worried about family reputation or the area where you live or religion/culture/values ...?
And Amrika is right you have a right to know about your fiance's past and that goes both ways. What did your ex want you to lie about ?
Amrika you said "Go find another person who can fully give herself to you and you alone with no reservation.You need to look at this from her point of view, she cannot/will not stand up to her parents for supposedly the most important person in her life-YOU so why the hell should you continue to suffer????? Are you so demented that you can't see you have been HAD in every sense; you have been taken advantage of and now have to live with the consequences. She is not there for you."
Amrika wait a minute have you ever even thought about what the girl ( Raymond i wish you would give her a name so that its easier like anon said even if its a fake one )thinks or feels ???? Being torn between your parents ( who have looked after you and brought you up and made you the person you are today ) and your s.o who you obviously care about and have fallen in love with is by no means an easy situation. No one should be placed in that sort of inhuman position to choose between doing right by both. its unfair because youre going to hurt one side whom you care about by going with the other and vice versa. At least in your case you know each other face to face for 4 years it starts getting strange when its someone you havent seen but thats another story. Amrika its not just Raymond who's "suffering" how do you think his gf well now his "ex" feels ?? wouldnt she feel the same thing ? How can you speak for Raymond and say "youve been had ?" how on earth would you know ? Raymond if during the time you were together you felt like you were being "had" and being taken advantage of, it wouldnt have lasted 4 years. You can safely generalise and say that short term relationships are probably more prone to one person "using" another in a rebound fashion or to make an ex jealous and these last a few weeks maybe 2-3 months at the most because its empty and the only basis of it is to get something out of it and once the goal is achieved it falls apart since there is no deeper connection other than the superficial. But 4 years even sometimes relationships about a year is different you would have been acting like a married couple already because you know them so well you know everything about each other have been honest and open with everything and love, respect and cherish each other because you know exactly what makes them tick and also how to push all their buttons. Amrika i thought that saying "she is not there for you" was rather a flippant comment you seem to assume things about this other woman like as if you know her or do you ? how can you just assume what she feels,is thinking or even the person she is in such a one sided manner ??
Raymond,
You are in a tough spot, no doubt, but you also have to face the fact that if your ex does tell him the truth he MAY NOT back off. What if he already fancies himself in love with her and will accept her on any terms? If as you say he will definitely back off then what will her parents say/do at that point? I think they will tell her to make it work at any cost and she will be stuck once again. You are very noble to want the best for her.
Yasmeen,
First of all, if you read all of Raymond's postings you would know the girl's parents don't want Raymond on any terms due to his religion. Even if he converted they will not accept him.
Secondly, I never said that his ex is not going thru anything differently, of course she is in an equally difficult position. But the difference is she is relying on Raymond to put himself on the line-write emails, buy plane tickets to make her future life better. I'd call that a person who's been HAD in every sense. Where the hell is she for Raymond but crying on the phone?? Is she trying to postpone the wedding, is she trying to get her mom on her side, is she planning to spend her life with Raymond any way she can? no. She calls him up and cries. Of course she is stuck betw. her parents and her love but at some point she has to take ownership of what she is doing to her love. She has to take ownership of the HUGE step she is about to take in her life and how it is driving Raymond into the ground, obviously.
Third, you said "But 4 years even sometimes
relationships about a year is different you would have been acting like a married couple already because you know them so well you know everything about each other have been honest and open with everything and love, respect and cherish each other because you know exactly what makes them tick and also how to push all their buttons." If that's true why do people divorce, why after 5, 10, 30 years do people part? How would you know that people together for at least 1 year know each other so well they get along for eternity? People use each other all the time all over the world and being together for any amount of time has nothing to do with whether a person can see they are being used or not. I personally think she has been 'had' also by her parents and their society; but since we only hear Raymond's side of the story, we can only respond to that. So please understand that we are supporting him and trying to get him back on track and do what is right for him.
Amrika if religion is not the issue then why wont they accept Raymond ? is it racial but then again im confused because Raymond says that his mother speaks hindi so Raymond are you of mixed background or adopted or something ? Sorry to ask you such personal things but im trying to look from your point of view.
And Raymond did you buy the plane tickets because your ex asked you to or did you do it on your own ? And Amrika i cant agree with you there buying plane tickets, going to a new country, new surroundings doesnt automatically mean a better future especially with someone you dont know very well. Its like jumping straight from frying pan to the fire. Raymond has this woman asked you to make her life better or take her away as a means of escape from what shes in is she relying on you financially ?
"If that's true why do people divorce, why after 5, 10, 30 years do people part? How would you know that people together for at least 1 year know each other so well they get along for eternity?"
I really dont know the answer to that Amrika im not a marriage counsellor, never been married/divorced before and am not a psychic or something to "look into my crystal ball and see the future"!! lol. However i do know that it takes two people to make a marriage work like two hands coming together to clap. Of course your s.o. or the person you've been with for 1,2 or even 4 years is going to have faults. duh !! Everyone does, but its a matter of learning to compromise and give and take. No and just since you know someone for a year doesnt mean that you know EVERYTHING about them youre quite right to correct me but what i meant to say was that you would know how they think and at least what their values are and you can judge for yourself. Actually let me have a stab at why people divorce. Some say the spark goes out of a marriage, like that of my parents though they still stay married but my grandparents have been together twice as long and yet they still hold hands. Why is that ? MArriages dont work if there are lies, infidelities, lack of trust and differences on which you cant see eye to eye on. And this applies to BOTH ARRANGED AND LOVE MARRIAGES. The amount of love marriages that end in divorce is rising because when two people are in love they forget to talk really TALK about the future of "us" as an individual and as a couple. They dont talk about how to deal with issues and problems beforehand but wait when it "happens" to discuss it when its really too late.I dont know if people change after marriage maybe some do and some dont maybe priorities change or maybe after the first year of marriage many find out that its not so easy and as romatic as they thought. Married life doesnt start with the honeymoon but afterwards when you come back. Then you may realise that Prince Charming snores in bed and expects breakfast in bed too ALL the time just an eg. Its not always the fairytale ending with "they lived happily ever after" reality is alot more harsh than that.
Dear Yasmeen & Missy Amrika,
To start with a "naming convention":
My ex gets the name: RB
The groom: MB
Hope this will work.
We have broken up the relationship, that's for sure. The love on the other hand will always remain because that hasn't been "broken", has not died or even faded away because that wasn't the reason why everythings is going the way it's going right now.
This is exactly what the problem is about.
On the other hand RB is the one who's in a huge fix. I asked her that if she's still in love with me the exact way she always was , then she has a big problem.................RB has a problem she answered honestly.
I'm trying to think only rationally instead of emotionally now, and it's going quite the good way. I'm trying to let RB think this way too. But everytime it's just collapsing of her mental state thinking and looking back, at the present and the future. I'm trying to make her think and feel differently now, because she has to. Buying a ticket for her for example: which ex-boyfriend would ever do this is he himself wasn't helped by this? I have a lot to loose too is this marriage won't go through, never forget that.
At this point I cannot fully agree with Amrika's statement: "....you have a right to know about your fiance's past". Believe me people, in this case it should be absolutely forbidden.......till the wedding is done at least............just dig this.
Yasmeen: "You need to look at this from her point of view, she cannot/will not stand up to her parents for supposedly the most important person in her life-YOU so why the hell should you continue to suffer?????".
RB would have done differently if her parents weren't this extreme in their thoughts and demands, if RB had the freedom or space to decide for herself.
Just visualise the following: suppose in front of you your father is holding a knife on your 14 year old brother, your mother is holding a knife ready to stab herself and the rest of family is there. Your father is demanding that you have to give in into his wishes, otherwise he will cut your brother's throat, your mother would stab herself imm. and the rest of the family will drown you with fuel and put you on fire............what would you do / decide? What will be on your conscience/guilt if you go against their demands?..........................Understood?.....................and now think that this is not anymore "suppose if", but pure reality and this incident is just 10% of the total demands...............Could you live with the guilt, would you still decide differently, would there be any solution?
There is just no other solution then supporting this decision now. And thank God at least that MB is a decent, educated and well-behaved man, as far as I understood and heard from RB. If you only knew how the other "candidates" are...........
RB's father wasn't actually happy with MB, because from his heart (as far as he has one) he cannot see RB happy. And besides this, MB is to much of a competitive son in law, because MB has a very succesfull career ahead. Everyone who does better than RB's father, is actually unacceptable for him..........he wants to stay the "God", the "Boss".....he wants to have ALL the controls in hand. RB's father is making MB's father sick at the moment now with asking him continuosly if everything is planned already......every day. That MB and his parents never wonder why there is so much of a hurry.....................they must smell something..............................Even RB's father is planning that after the marriage he wants to stay every half year in the States with them........to still have all the controls or at least to bug them, can you imagine?
Even if it's the case that "I've been had". I really don't care, serious I don't. I never put any value to what RB's parents thought about me. I know what RB was to me, feels for me and what she herself would have done if the parents wouldn't have been there. And people, this is the only thing that counts for me.
Just like Yasmeen said/asked: "i can't imagine the two of you being in love, and the parents having already met you, and furthermore know you and your family and still not approve ?": If I knew the answer....I would tell you guys. But it's not for me or RB's happiness that the parents decided differently or did otherwise, no it's for their own joy, their own egoism, their own "pride" to show to the outside world that they're deciding like this now.
Missy Amrika: "You are in a tough spot, no doubt, but you also have to face the fact that if your ex does tell him the truth he MAY NOT back off. What if he already fancies himself in love with her and will accept her on any terms?" : I can only pray to God that this WILL be the case............going through of this marriage means directly my peace !!!!
"If as you say he will definitely back off then what will her parents say/do at that point?": they will search/find someone else as easy/quickly as they found MB. But MB seems, like I said before, to be a decent guy and hopefullly a good husband. You don't know how the other candidates were: . So let it please be MB.
"First of all, if you read all of Raymond's postings you would know the girl's parents don't want Raymond on any terms due to his religion. Even if he converted they will not accept him": it's not the religion even. I believe in a God, but absolutely not in a religion. There are as many ways to get to God then there are religions: they all lead to the same God.........all religions are different, but have the same goal. No, it's not the religion. It's only about the fact that I make RB terribly happy and loved, and this the parents cannot accept................strange he? wouldn't every parents wish this in the first place for their children ? (these are my own mother's words).
I never had any say in the consequences of their (RB and her family) decisions, so who am I now to say anything now?
They decided, they clean up the mess !! I won't be there. I'm just not the kind of person who can stand lies, pain or blackmailing.
In law they say "it's better to let go of thousand guilty people, then to sentence one innocent".
"Buying a ticket for her for example: which ex-boyfriend would ever do this is he himself wasn't helped by this?"
Raymond spell it out for me how on earth is buying a ticket to go see her future husband going to help you ???? Are you planning to lose her sooner by literally helping them to get together or something ??are you saying that you'll be deliriously happy when RB a woman who you say you have loved for 4 years marries someone and you yourself are helping them along ?? "I have a lot to lose too if this marriage won't go through, never forget that." again i dont understand. what else are you going to lose other than the woman you say you love and also "going through of this marriage means directly my peace !!" please explain what does peace mean in this context ?
And Raymond about knowing about your fiance's past
"Believe me people, in this case it should be absolutely forbidden.......till the wedding is done at least............just dig this." why ?? Is there something about you that you DONT want her to know or ever know ? Are you hiding something or ashamed of something ? were you lying to her by keeping secrets from her for 4 years ?
"Even RB's father is planning that after the marriage he wants to stay every half year in the States with them........to still have all the controls or at least to bug them, can you imagine?" i would have to say that this is a no-no. The inlaws and anyone other than the married couple should not live in the same house. Holidays and visits and dinners and maybe staying up to a month or a few weeks is another thing but 6 months at a time, every YEAR or the inlaws staying there ALL the time is too much. I think Indian movies perhaps do the evil mother-in-law character too stereotypically. I mean not all motherinlaws are like that but then again tensions are likely between the husband his mother and his wife if it comes to an argument. Same thing if the wife has her parents living with them. THe parents are obviously going to side with and support their own children even when they know deep down that their children are wrong and if it comes to an argument unnecessary words are said. Then it doesnt just become something between the husband and wife it involves the whole family oh boy !! can someone say world war III here ? it sounds funny now but im sure when youre in the thick of it with words shooting forth like bullets you wont be laughing then :). It is rare that the parent/s of the husband or the wife would actually say in front of their child's spouse "No, you were wrong and should apologise he/she is right in this matter." It would likely be said when they are alone but not in front of the 'other party' to use an Indian cliche. it is pride and nothing else the "lets stick together and show unity and solidarity.? united we stand and divided we fall ?? i dont know.
Raymond those "stab" scenes with the mother holding a knife and the father threatening them only happens in movies or else in a very seriously dysfunctional family or in a mental institution. These days the father can still be a 'terror' not because he holds a knife but because he is so firm, rigid, strident and hot tempered in his opinions. Like the one not worth arguing with over pretty much anything that goes against 'his' opinion. You cant possibly risk losing what you have to lose maybe everything ? for someone you barely know i mean how rational is that ? If you know exactly who you're well sort of involved with, it would be different but a stranger with no face ??
"I believe in a God, but absolutely not in a religion. There are as many ways to get to God then there are religions: they all lead to the same God.........all religions are different, but have the same goal." Is that the same way that RB feels about it too ? Are you both as spiritual as the other or is one of you more spiritual ? If she is the more spiritual of the two of you ? does she go to the temple/church/mosque and want you to come or does she not care what you do ? i realise i asked you quite a few questions i apologise :) and this is quite long so i'll leave it here.
Dear Yasmeen,
“Raymond spell it out for me how on earth is buying a ticket to go see her future husband going to help you ???? Are you planning to lose her sooner by literally helping them to get together or something ??”: Yes, the quicker RB gets out of this mess, gets far away from her parents, the quicker MY own mind, thoughts and worries will settle down too. I was the one who asked RB if she wanted to go to the States. She thought about it and agreed. She knows exactly why I asked her this: to make this marriage work, that it will go through. Just because it HAS to go through, for her and for me.
First of all because she has to leave this place, that has the highest priority. Secondly, thank God it’s this one (MB) because if it would have been one of the other candidates, another hell would start. Third: I want to go ahead with my life too. If I keep on worrying about her (and it’s impossible not to if she stays here) I can never go ahead !!
The basic of it all is that my mind won’t rest, I won’t have peace if she’s not far away from her parents and/or if she’s not in “good” hands. And as far as I now understand, MB is a reasonable person. The ticket buying is neccesary, because there are a few things RB and MB have to sort out in person: he has a few questions now he got to know of my “existence”. RB has to convince MB that it (relationship, love, etc.) is over between her and me. Talking to him in PERSON will possibly make him think that she is very serious about the wedding, to make him feel special because she came all the way for him. “Lying through my teeth”, to put it in her words.
But I hope it won’t even be necessary to talk about me, cause at the end he is and will always stay an Indian man. RB doesn’t know him that much to know what can happen if she’ll talk about me.
For example: RB father is coming back from India on the 9th of dec. RB told MB about this. Instead of being even a tiny bit of a comfort to her, he was just “laughing away to glory” to put it in the exact words RB was using. That really upsets her…..”If he only knew” RB cried.
I mean, MB will never be in the same position as where RB and I were, he’ll never face the same difficulties and problems as we faced. It won’t even be good for him. But trying at least to think from her position is the least he can do for her isn’t it?……………..I mean he’s gonna be her husband for God sake !! And it’s not that he doesn’t know already how the father is, cause RB told him the main thing about her father already.
Your next question dear Yasmeen:
“"Believe me people, in this case it should be absolutely forbidden.......till the wedding is done at least............just dig this." why ?? Is there something about you that you DONT want her to know or ever know ? Are you hiding something or ashamed of something ? were you lying to her by keeping secrets from her for 4 years ? : there is absolutely nothing to hide.
I was referring to Missy Amrika’s “As for the Yankee asking about you, he has EVERY RIGHT to do that! You are so wrong there; if you were in his position, wouldn't you ask and want the TRUTH about your fiance's past??!!”., on the 29th of november.
No, I don’t think nor RB thinks so. In this case the truth will destroy the whole marriage. RB will tell him the truth in time she said. For now she cannot afford to, because the possible price of not getting married due to telling the truth, is too “high” now.
Other things like her studies, mental state, etc., etc. play along too. She would graduate in feb. and after this she would go to the States, marry and stay there permanently. Now, it seems that she will gruaduate in june !! That’s too long waiting, in other words: she has to come to Holland after marrying in feb. and then again to the States in June. I advised her now to stay permanently in the States as of coming december. She’ll ask MB if that’s possible.
About her father staying every half year at their place: they have to decide. Who am I to say anything about it. The only thing I could advise them is to realise very well that only RB and MB have to commit to eachother, not to the rest of the family. But maybe it’ll make MB richer in knowing RB past if he comes to know how the father really is, what kind of a “human” being he really is……………….. But who am I again. Life will go it’s own way………
“Raymond those "stab" scenes with the mother holding a knife and the father threatening them only happens in movies or else in a very seriously dysfunctional family or in a mental institution”, BINGO !!!!!!!
Me myself would laugh at this hindi-movie-kind-of-playing if it wasn’t that her parents are REALLY capable of doing so.
“Are you both as spiritual as the other or is one of you more spiritual ? If she is the more spiritual of the two of you ? does she go to the temple/church/mosque and want you to come or does she not care what you do ?”: like I said before, we both believe in “something” higher………….in a God. But we’re both not hung up to a religion. She is hindu, I’m Muslim. RB is not going only to a mandir, I’m not going only to a mosque either. She just loves to pray and it doesn’t matter where, if it’s a mandir, mosque or church. The same thing goes with me. Most of the times I go with my (hindu) friends to kirtan (sorry if I spell this wrong). Because this gives me a lot of inner peace. Going ONLY to a mosque would be “supporting” the supposed unique religion and I don’t want it, nor believe it. I’m not an extremist.
WEll if MB is really better than you Raymond then maybe he is if you YOURSELF feel that way. Perhaps hes not afraid to be honest about everything and come out in his own right. i wish you well Raymond and best of luck.
Dear Yasmeen,
Sometimes a lie ITSELF is better then the truth, and indeed in this case he is and will always be better, he should be!!...............so at the end it's not me nor RB who's the real victim and that's exactly our purpose, as mean and evil as this may sound.
Sometimes people like to take another identity, like to come to the open in another personality...........why?: only for their own egoistic desires..........................
Just one thing just because you may decide to go mainly to a church doesnt necessarily mean you're an extremist. An extremist is someone who kills, maims, robs and commits other unlawful acts and even declares war on people because of religion and or religious differences. There is nothing wrong with going to only one place of worship if thats what you believe. You are entitled to go anywhere you want.
a lie is better than the truth yes absolutely. its the best way to hurt those you love, so please keep on doing it. A lie is like keeping someone in a dark room and knowing where the door to freedom is but not wanting to tell them. So as they hit themselves on objects and fall and get hurt as they try and find that door you're on the other side just watching, either enjoying it or you've got yourself so deep under every lie that you just cant come out now and tell them anymore. Thats not fair is it ? Why should you have to take on someones elses personality if youre comfortable with your own ? Are you so self intolerant towards yourself that you feel that other people will feel the same ? lies always have a victim Raymond and its the person whos been lied to so please dont delude yourself or try and feel less guilty about it.
Hello everybody. I am a Japanese student studying at univ. about marriages in India and Japan. Both countries have the same custom as arranged marriages so now I'm writing a thesis comparing India (mainly Hindu society) and Japan. Because Japan's such custom has not been sustained any more for these several decades, people get married to whoever they love. But on the other hand, arranging a marriage is still popular and it remains deeply in Indian culture, doesn't it? I guess there're lots of reasons for it, religion, caste system, and so on. I'm planning to research how much Indian people are satisfied with a traditional marriage system. I'd like to know your active opinion about arranged marriages 'cause now I can get information only from lots of books. Fortunately I've found this page... so reading your voices, I got many new questions about Indian marriages.
I'm making a questionaire at this moment and I'm looking for people who can cooperate with me in answering it. I would be greatful if anybody gets interested and replys to me. Thank you very much!!
Raymond,
All i can say is i hope you find your way with or without RB. Whether you think MB will get her the "freedom" she needs is only something you know. And for everyone's sake i do sincerely hope he is as good as you think he is. Just curious-is she planning to tell him about her physical relations with u before they get married? BELIEVE me, i work in the medical field and if drs. don't know, men do not always know on the wedding nite also.
Go to your destiny!
Yasmeen,
You are right, lies only hold people back in life. But i have to tell you that as a person who has never married/divorced as you said you are, you are clueless as to what a committed lifelong relationship entails. As such maybe you should just keep your opinions on a topic in which you have some experience. i'm not putting you down, just pointing out you have NO idea what it is like to have the typical hindustan inlaw lifestyle, what people like Raymond go thru. You sound like an intelligent person, i think even you can get the drift of what i'm saying.
Raymond is Guyanese, that's why RB (Ritu Bhatia?) parents will not have him as a son in law
"You are right, lies only hold people back in life. But i have to tell you that as a person who has never married/divorced as you said you are, you are clueless as to what a committed lifelong relationship entails. As such maybe you should just keep your opinions on a topic in which you have some experience. i'm not putting you down, just pointing out you have NO idea what it is like to have the typical hindustan inlaw lifestyle, what people like Raymond go thru. You sound like an intelligent person, i think even you can get the drift of what i'm saying."
Yeah i think i get your drift and perhaps youre right too no harm done. I shall leave you to advise Raymond since you do it much better than anyone else here. Actually you think much better for Raymond than he himself which must be a consolation. Goodluck to both of you and all the best of regards i have other things to worry about.
Dear Missy Amrika,
It's clear to me that you are really the only one who does understand, even this case.
"Just curious-is she planning to tell him about her physical relations with u before they get married?": I don't know. I advised RB not to.
Earlier Yasmeen stated the following: "I really dont know the answer to that Amrika im not a marriage counsellor, never been married/divorced before and am not a psychic or something to "look into my crystal ball and see the future"!!".
That's how superficial people think: IT HAS VERY LESS TO DO WITH MARRIAGE AS SUCH, IT'S ABOUT HUMANITY IN THE FIRST PLACE.
But indeed Yasmeen has "other things to worry about", like first going to a counsellor before trying to become one.
It's very sad that Yasmeen wanted to be competitive with you instead of just making her point of view clear..........her's WAS as valuable as all the others.
I must show my respect for the anonymous "Sherlock Holmes" though: not having similar ones, he/she can look into a crystal ball and knows it all.................."Ritu Bhatia"?, yeah sure......cheers on you too !!
Some people have seen so less in life............but know the most...........
Raymond i wasnt trying to be competitive or be a counsellor how could i since i keep saying the wrong things all the time as you and miss amrika feel ? i dont have a rational unemotional point of view because the 'other things i have to worry about' have taken their emotional toll. BUt then you wouldnt understand so this is quite pointless.
and just another thing when you're too emotionally involved you cant think straight and its not about humanity Raymond it never was. Its about knowing enough about someone to risk everything for them for love or anything else.
I HAVE WILL BE GIVING A SPEECH ON ARRANGED MARRIAGE. I WOULD APPRECIATE IF ANYONE CAN GIVE ME SOME IDEAS OR POINTS TO ARGUE FOR ARRANGED MARRIAGES.
Usha,
One of the points that arranged marriages are advantageous than love marriages is that the parents of the two betrothed know each other and you know the personalities of the soon-to-be arranged couple (i.e. their son/daughter-in-law) that they should be a good arranged couple when they reach adulthood.
Dexter its not an advantage its just added knowledge. The simple fact that the parents of the couple know each other is the crucial factor. It sets their mind at rest. They want to know what the other family's like and who their daughter/son is getting involved with. See in South east Asian tradition X doesnt just marry Y, X marries "into" Y's family. So if the families cant get along then X and Y have no hope of making it work. And they tend to judge the future son in law for eg by his family especially the father i.e. if his father was wayward in a particular area they assume that the son will be like that in the future and the same with the daughterinlaw and her mother. i dont believe in arranged marriages or love marriages because ive seen some cases of both 'choices' not working in my own family and that of relatives. It really makes you wonder then why do people get married for in the first place to make each other miserable for the rest of your married lives if you make the wrong choice ? MAybe thats why its been termed the 'longest life sentence' one can have. If thats what it is then i dont want anything to do with it. Its funny because when two people get married they dont hope that it would end up on the rocks so where did all that initial love go, what happened ? If youre not sure about someone and have your doubts about them at the start then maybe you shouldnt be spending eternity with them either. Dexter do you have some Irish lineage in you ? just wondering.
Dear Usha,
Maybe an idea or point for discussion: why arranged marriage cannot be two-sided, more the thought of an arranged-love marriage.
Arranged marriage in it's present shape, is too much a decision of the parents. The child who's gonna marry, has very less, or no, say in it.
Marriage is a commitment between 2 people in the 1st place, not only a commitment between 2 families. It's also not choosing for or the marriage or the family, no it should be finding the perfect combination of both.
Arrangement should be what an arrangement purely means: the families can arrange the 2 people meeting & knowing eachother, the families can arrange the wedding ceremony, the date, the place, the preparations, the invitation, etc., etc. But the same families cannot arrange, forcast or demand the 2 really falling in love with eachother. That has to come from both their hearts and has to grow in time. If that's not there at the time of the marriage, then it's quite riskfull. In some cases (also in my case if you read it) there is just no space for the child to give his/her opinion, at least taking the final decision.
And that's so wrong, cause first of all the marriage itself would not be based on a true confesion, on true/real love between the two, and 2nd: the chance of an unsuccesfull marriage/life is higher. And what happens then to the same two families who insisted, forced the marriage in the first place, when separating or divorce comes around the corner?
Marriage & divorce sounds so simple in the western world, but if marriage is so easy to arrange in the eastern culture, why divorce gives exactly the opposite thought? Everyone or "family" can make mistakes, but when problems occur they still stick to their pride, instead of choosing for the same child who they suppose to love and care for.
Raymond,
Thank you for seeing that I am trying to help u. The only way to handle such a difficult time is thru finding as much strength as you can. Only u can know what it's like and only u can decide when/if the time comes for u to move on etc. If it makes your mind feel more at ease to send RB on the plane to meet MB, then u will be able to take the consequences becuz u are the one choosing the actions leading up to that point. Therefore also only u know how much u can stand to hear about her future without u once she returns from her trip. Everytime I read a posting from you it is so sad. Wish there was some way for everyone to find happiness in this world; one thing u said in your earlier postings is very true. You said that people should think of their future kids and whether what is happening is fair and would they give their kids the same respect? (synopsis of what u posted earlier) You are so right there, it may be too late for u but our generation needs to look forward and make sure this cycle of unhappiness does not continue. For myself I plan to follow that path and will never force my kids to marry someone against their choice. If they ask me to help them choose a spouse, that is different.
PS I enjoyed your response to Sherlock Holmes, try to take that frame of mind and apply it to your life when possible also. :}
Raymond - didnt know that people living in the netherlands used the expression 'just dig this.' Hmmm you must be a 70's shaft fan and let me guess a star wars fan to boot.
Raymond think about it this way. Parents in the end cant 'force' their child into any marriage. If RB loves you she would say no to anyone else. In the end if your relationship is really an intertwining of souls it will endure anything that stands in the way. If it is fate that you should be together at any cost then things will work themselves out its almost as if God will make a way. The only way to test the strength and commitment of any relationship (friendship/lovers/spouse is through obstacles. So you can see for yourself if the relationship is not strong enough to overcome them maybe it is too 'shaky' a foundation for future obstacles and then it would finally crack anyway. You know theres a saying about how you cant have roses without thorns well you cant have love without pain. Thats my 2 cents and trust me i think when you do start to love someone it hurts and this time i do know what im talking about im experiencing it.
Dear Missy Amrika,
You are a great comfort to me.
"If it makes your mind feel more at ease to send RB on the plane to meet MB, then u will be able to take the consequences becuz u are the one choosing the actions leading up to that point. Therefore also only u know how much u can stand to hear about her future without u once she returns from her trip":
There is just no other option Missy Amrika, she has to marry him, though she really doesn't want to. But instead of trying to stop this wedding, it's better to help her. Just try to feel how RB is feeling at the moment: ripped off from the one she love, shifting and leaving for another country, forced to be with someone she doesn't know from the heart, doubting about the future......love and to be loved.
RB has too many problems, and not the smallest!! Trying to make her think different now will lead to other complications.
To put it in a very simple way, but also a very realistic way: it's or this wedding or her death, like her father told her. And once again: he WILL if RB goes against his demands, he is that crazy.
Besides the stab-scene (10% of the problems), the other 90% is worse, but that I cannot tell now......I can only tell it after the marriage.
So it's not a matter of choosing, because there is no choice, at least for RB.
It has to be seen in time if MB will be good to her, cause one thing I had to promise RB: I will always be there for her..........she asked me to promise. But even if she didn't ask me, she knows that I'll always be her guardian angel. And oh boy..........MB should better be good to her.......I don't know if he'll be oke, I can only hope it.
The basic of it all is: she doesn't want to get married, I don't want her to get married....but looking at the consequences when going against it, it's better to make the best of it for now.
For her parents it's the wedding, but from her own heart she want MB to become just a good friend for the time being, when she's in the States. I feel very sorry for MB, because if MB already started loving RB he'll go through the same proces after some time.
She's just satisfying her parents for the time being.........later she'll definitly return.
Thursday the 14th I'll drop her at the airport, wednesday the 20th I'll pick her up again..........let's see if she can convince MB.
Raymond,
I just can't even get close to imagining how RB feels right now, what she goes thru. You are an extremely patient man to tell RB you'll always be there for her, even after her marriage to another. I know those stab scenes do not only happen in hindi films and obviously RB lives it everyday. How sad that her parents don't see by getting their happiness they are breaking their daughter's spirit. A friend of mine went thru a similar situation, being an only child she wanted to marry her b/f (difference being they were the same religion). But the father was VERY controlling and wanted to choose her man etc. so much so that she would develop physical ailments due to the stress. She just persisted and the parents gave in at the end cause she showed they were responsible and he was a good man etc. She was very lucky, but it took time. In your case I think the time is quickly running out and the options are even less.
Do RB's parents know you bought her the ticket and she's going and that u are the chaffeur to and from the airport? I bet she will tell them some girl from school will take her. Is there a time limit when she will return after marriage or is she going to just wait and see? No matter what she tells u and how close u are, I think u know that life changes dramatically after marriage, esp. the first one! Just if, only IF there is the possibility she falls for MB, are u preparing yourself u may never see her again? Also, what happens if she cannot convince MB, is there a plan in that event, esp if her parents don't know she will be going in the first place?
To put it in a sentence: you have a lot going on right now!! I know you're worried about her, but don't neglect your feelings in the process.
Dear Missy Amrika,
“How sad that her parents don't see by getting their happiness they are breaking their daughter's spirit. A friend of mine went thru a similar situation, being an only child she wanted to marry her b/f (difference being they were the same religion). But the father was VERY controlling and wanted to choose her man etc. so much so that she would develop physical ailments due to the stress. She just persisted and the parents gave in at the end cause she showed they were responsible and he was a good man etc. “ : RB’s parents see how she’s breaking down. Not now, after the marriage is “fixed”, but since a longer time….. a few years already. But the parents just don’t care. Opposite to your friend’s case, RB’s parents don’t have that kind of love for their child, they don’t have any limits in their demands. As long as the magic 4 is there they’re statisfied (Hindu, money, PhD, USA) and don’t see any problems. Basic: the parents think that the things that make themselves happy, will make RB happy too. But RB is a complete different person, a different personality, different interests.
For example: RB wants to know MB better from his HEART but the mother’s complaining only about the fact that MB gave RB “only a box of chocolates and a teddybear” instead of some money or jewellery. “He and his parents better spend a lot of money for the wedding, etc., etc.”, the mother is telling MB through RB.
The father doesn’t know that RB is going to see MB ( for him it’s a study-trip to somewhere) The mother knows that RB is going. Initially the mother didn’t want RB to go, because RB made the mistake of telling her mother that I bought the ticket…...how stupid that was actually. Now RB managed to convince her mother differently. Of course the parents don’t know either that I’m going to drop & pick her up. But that’s just something so small.
“No matter what she tells u and how close u are, I think u know that life changes dramatically after marriage, esp. the first one! Just if, only IF there is the possibility she falls for MB, are u preparing yourself u may never see her again?”: if MB and RB REALLY fall in love with eachtother, REALLY are happy and if RB will have a good and peacefull life, I’ll absolutely “give up” RB, I’ll absolutely “set her free”. And you know why?: because that’s exactly what I always wanted to do for and with her……to make her happy, to give her peace and to make her feel loved………her happiness is my happiness……her peace is my peace……..my love is her love. It’s hard that to face that it’s not RB & me (now), because the love is still there, from both sides……………but her staying here in Holland will lead to more difficulties, hurt & misery.
First things first: she has to go from here. Then we'll see how we go further........
Raymond,
I hear everything you're saying and know you are speaking from your heart. How interesting that RB's mom is alright with you buying her plane tickets to go to MB; but then she did seem to be more reasonable than her dad from your postings. Do you think her dad is so clueless that he would buy that study trip story? He sounds very calculating and I would not be surprised if he does know the truth also but pretends otherwise. Even if he does, seems like it does not change that he still gets what he wants in the end, as you say. True, it is irrelevant in the end that you are driving her to and from the airport, I was just curious if they knew how close you two are even now.
Once again, I don't know what else I can write for you but if it's RB's peace you desire most, maybe you need to find that peace for yourself in the end. There's an Indian saying that whatever it is you covet most, want the most, that is what you need to give away first. Then it will return to you 10-fold in some way. So in your case, maybe sending her to be with MB is what will in some roundabout way find you happiness in your life. It is so amazing to consider that as an option; but what else is really left?
Best Wishes to you.
Dear Missy Amrika,
"How interesting that RB's mom is alright with you buying her plane tickets to go to MB; but then she did seem to be more reasonable than her dad from your postings": No, you got it wrong or I must have explained it wrong. When I gave RB the idea/option to go and see MB she told her mother that. But her mother reacted in such an awfull & evil way, that later (when the ticket was bought) RB changed the whole thing into another story.......as far as the mother "knows" now, I have nothing to do with her going.
"Do you think her dad is so clueless that he would buy that study trip story?": We did this before. When we went for holidays or when RB wanted to spend a few days at my house, we lied (like typical 15 year old kids) that RB went on a school trip or something else.
If the father believed it or not, as long as RB was left in peace and we could be together, it was all fine.
Missy Amrika, it seems that you're gonna stop writing to me. If this is the case: thanks you more than I can say/write for your support, care & advise. You know what you're talking about............
Take care...........
HEY!!!!!
first time posting on this so not sure what to say!!!!!!
Anyways i dont know what everyone is arguing (discussing) i had an love arranged marriage i was introduced to my husband by my family. We dated for a few weeks and then decided to get married and now where happy. His family respects my very much!!!! My younger brother-inlaws tell me everything and i help them out much as possible and i get along with my mother and father inlaw. My husband and i go on trip once every year and we all visit my family once or twice a year
So i argee with love arranged marriages!!!!!
But everyones questions and opinions are welcomed!!!!
"Sometimes people like to take another identity, like to come to the open in another personality...........why?: only for their own egoistic desires.......................... "
Raymond im concerned about you. I think i know whats going on now and it freaks me out. It seems as if you suffer from multiple personality disorder or else you're just creating identities if you have nothing better to do with your time. Im not sure if there is actually a poster by the name of Amrika or if its actually you Raymond using another identity. Please get help and counselling or get prescriptions/medication to help you to come to terms with your situation before you self destruct.
Simran,
You are the exception to the norm. It is so rare to hear a story like yours, quite honestly. How long did you get to know your husband prior to marriage, and did your families know each other prior also? Do u live in India or abroad?
Yasmeen,
Please! Get a clue, could Raymond come up with the awesome advice i give him? plus can you tell any diff. betw. the way i write and he writes-articulate and cultural differences? plus why would he say he thinks i'm signing off and thank me for advice etc.? i do agree, he may need some medication though for hanging onto the fantasy that he'll be happy when RB is off and married to MB. only he could know how much pain one man can bear.
Raymond,
I did not mean to imply i'm signing off but i just am at a loss as to what else i can say to help u out?? Sorry if i got it wrong about her mother-she does sound just as mean as the dad. and if RB can get away with a few days away from the folks, wow- the dad IS clueless. if u want to keep writing i'll try and respond if u have any concerns/ques that i can help with but otherwise i don't have much else to offer u. it's funny you say that i know what i'm talking about i don't think that way, i just offer what i feel. just remember that everyone in this world has a story and a skeleton in their closet. not everyone is willing to share it with the world, as you are. i have a great network of family and friends so that contributes to my peace of mind no matter what life throws at u. i'm not talking about RB or anyone in particular now, just a general discussion. in part that's why hindustani's tend not to have the social and psychological probs. as much as the western world, i think. family and community support and constant interaction keep all of us 'in line' and reminds us of what we value and why. just look at the rate of single moms in each culture; unfortunately some indian women stay in an abusive relationship just due to the fact of 'what will the community think?' so our culture is not perfect above all by any means, i want everyone to understand. yet overall i'd still prefer to be in my culture, aloo pranthas and the ever present love and support of my parents at ANY time in my life are irreplacable to me.
all that is just an interesting aside, stream of consciousness...what do U think dear Raymond?
Missy Amrika
Just to answer your questions. My family didnt know my husbands family well. This is how my story unfolds. My husband saw me at my cousins wedding for the first time. He then later approached his parents about me and his parents approached my parents about. They all decided that me and my husband should go out on a blind date. My parents then asked my about it i declined straight out i was only 17. After a few hours of listening to my parents i agreed on few conditions. The conditions being that i could stay out as late as i wanted and i didnt have to share any details my parents agreed and the blind date was set up. When i first saw my husband i was instantly attracted to him. We went out a few more times. I then started university so my classes and becoming something in life became more important to me. My husband ( then boyfriend) would get upset that i didnt see him often enough. I couldnt handle school and having a relationship with someone. So shortly after university started i broke up with him getting him to understand that i still had a future to plan. He was upset but i think he was ok. I moved on but something kept wondering how he was doing or where he was. I knew having a second chance with him was impossible so i moved on and dated a few guys in university but they all drank and did other stuff. I always compared every guy to him. A graduated from university with my BSC 2.5 years later and moved back in with my parents to continue my studies in getting my MD degree. I met up with him again at a backyard barbeque my parents throw once in a while. I was scared to approach him thinking he is married and has kids and i wouldnt be able to handle that depressing news. After a while we final approached each other and learned he was single. I knew going out with him again was impossible so we just talked and left it at that. My sister said that my eyes light up when i saw him. She was bugging me i knew that. After days later after the party he came over and spilled his heart out saying that he still liked my alot and did trying going out with others girls but it just didnt seem rite. That he wanted a second chance ( i wanted the second chance to) so i agreed and we went out a few times and he then propsosed and the following summer we got married.
I live in canada
Simran
umm, ok, i just came upon this place randomly.. just wanted to say arranged marriages might work for some people, but i am prolly not one of them. being raised muslim in a bengali family overseas, i guess i had alot more freedom than most people in the same position. my parents had an arranged marriage, n i guess they get along well, but i'm not too into this idea. first, one of my friends had one of these n told me NEVER NEVER to get married, 2nd, i am definitely not what these "desi" brown people are lookin for. i'm loud n like to talk a good deal, also stubborn as hell. anywayz, most people r lookin for a good religious girl, n i am decidedly not muslim. like this raymond guy i've come to terms that there is something (god or what have u) but i don't like formalized religion or the constraints it places upon me being myself. another thing, desis, being a predominantly brown people, have a fascination for white white skin, which is seldom found in the population. i'm nice n brown mocha colored, and no one is really looking for that, tho i am supercute! :)plus i gotta good boy, n he is cute n redhaired freckly irish type. he likes the 'exoticness' of the brown skin. so why not choose something like that, rather than be stuck in a society where my skin color is my greatest vice? think bout it.. there's lots of people in the world.. why limit yourself to just desis?
Simran,
Interesting story of your life, glad for you and hope it lasts a long time, sounds like a good start! Do you live with his parents or on your own?
Missy Amrika
Thanx!!!! I do live with my inlaws who respect me very much. However what about you no love or marriage???
Simran
Simran,
I am married and that was arranged, so I do know what I'm talking about when it comes to inlaws and the interrelationships etc. It's not so much to do with love as it used to be, in my opinion, as 2 people who can get along and have compatibility nowadays.
Simran and Missy Amrika, my story is similar as well, except my husband was my elder brother's classmate. He pressured me and my parents to see if we were compatible. We went out for just one night, I liked him instantly also. Then, we both forgot about it, each assuming that the other was not interested. After a year or so, my brother invited him to another party, and this time we went out seriously. Our parents didn't know each other very well, except through my brother.
It's worked out very well. We both have excellent relationships, and our parents too get along very well. I'm blessed.
IS THIS NEWSGROUP NOTHING WITHOUT KADIR POSTING ANYMORE?
my 2 cents
Arranged marriage, I grew up in the US, husband from India but broadminded, married 10years, 2 kids and probably going through a midlife crisis since I'm trying to reevaluate my life. Maybe even harder is the fact that I thought that love would eventually come after the marriage or so thats what they say. It didn't, even 10 years later. So here's my 2 cents. I made a mistake and will probably have to live with that as a DIVORCE would be tramatic to my kids which I could never forgive myself. But reading your emails here and on other boards, I WILL NEVER EVER GET INVOLVED IN ARRANGING A MARRIAGE FOR MY KIDS. LET THEM MARRY WHOMEVER THEY WANT AND LEARN TO LIVE WITH WHATEVER DECISIONS THEY MAKE." I hope all your parents are as openminded as I hope to become one day. My experience with arranged marriages has left a bitter taste in my mouth. The sad part of this whole thing is that my husband has never done anything to me to make me dislike him. Its just that my idea of marriage was love and physical attraction after which came the compatability, conversation, mutual interests. I got everything but love and physical attraction. I feel like my I've missed out on a great deal of my life.
Good luck to you all. I've learned a lot within the last 3 hours from the multiple boards I've read. This is the first boards I've actually responded to.
Desi,
I hear you, that is why I told Kadir I don't have much to offer in the way of advice anymore. I'd like to be helpful, but what can one say now as he progresses as he sees fit? What would YOU like to discuss?
RV,
You definitely are blessed and sounds like a happy life ahead for you.
Midlife Crisis,
This story of your marriage is the most common one nowadays. But interesting that the issues seem to be more of the love as you say; mostly it's the others compatibility, mutual interests etc that girls from the US do not find in most guys from India. I have several friends in the same boat as you for many different reasons. One of them also has 2 boys but was taking physical abuse for 6 years, she did finally leave him. 10 years is a huge investment, sounds like you have thought of leaving but are staying for the kids. I know of friends in that situation also, what effect is your continued unhappiness going to have on them? In order to take care of them, their mother has to have the best life possible also. Tough spot being that he sounds like a nice guy also; you have to make a list of the good/bad things in your marriage and see which list is longer and more important in the end. Just my 2 cents also.
Missy Amrika
Yasmeen,
seems that you're busy since a couple of days. Or do you have more than a "sound" interest?
Just see your interest and feelings as the situation where you have to crave for the mother that you never had, or you're own sister who's on the edge of a divorce caused by her inlaws.
You're "curiousity" has revealed more than you thought only by writing: ".... and trust me i think when you do start to love someone it hurts and this time i do know what im talking about im experiencing it".
Who'll have the last laugh?
"Or do you have more than a "sound" interest?
Just see your interest and feelings as the situation where you have to crave for the mother that you never had, or you're own sister who's on the edge of a divorce caused by her inlaws."
huh ??? what was that all about ?? For your information i dont have a sister so i cant have a sister whos on the edge of a divorce and neither do i have a brother. Go figure. My mother is very much alive and both my parents are still together and i dont have to "crave for a mother" because my mom is always there for me and always will be. sheesh. What is this ? some kind of personal vendetta/attack against me and my personal life ? You dont even know me in the first place to make assumptions like that and how dare you !!
You're "curiousity" has revealed more than you thought only by writing: ".... and trust me i think when you do start to love someone it hurts and this time i do know what im talking about im experiencing it".
Yes i was busy because for the last few days was spending time with my potential 'husband and his family.' And he has every material thing that you could want. But he doesnt have what i want. So "Who'll have the last laugh?" well my comm will for saying no to the guy with everything and for thinking that ive lost my judgement completely. there, Anonymous on Friday, December 15, 2000 - 08:46 pm i hope you're satisfied.
Yasmeen,
I just wanted to support you on your decision to turn down "the guy who has everything" because he did not have what you wanted. I read your earlier postings when you said that you did not believe in either love or arranged marriages because neither one seemed to last and I thought that I could give you a little hope. I met my husband when I was 17 and he was 18 in college ...we dated for 3 years and were deeply in love and we married. We just celebrated our 27th anniversary and we are still deeply in love. We have raised 2 healthy, happy and successful sons. We have had a wonderful life together even though my husband was quite ill for several years. When you love someone it is easier to overcome life's difficulties because there are always two of you sharing the burdens. Every day together is a new day of love..we still laugh and hug and hold hands just like young lovers. If you can find your soul mate ...your other half ...the one who will stand beside you thru good times and bad...then maybe you will change your mind about marriage. Good luck to you. My heart goes out to you.
Dear Missy Amrika,
I’ve been away for some days. But I’m back now with the follow up.
Brought RB to the airport on the 14th and picked her up again today, the 20th.
What can I say..........
"The love is there between him and me.....but it’s not even 1% of what I still feel for you Asfar, it doesn’t even feel as "love" that I have with you. I tried my very best but can never love MB the way I love you.......", is what RB concluded.
I really don’t know what to do anymore.
Like Yasmeen wrote, she has the decision in her own hands to say NO to the guy...Yasmeen is very, very lucky in this way. But RB has no say....she has to go according the parents wish.
RB flew immediately in my arms and put her head on my chest.....kept on kissing and hugging and kissing and hugging.....the tears kept on rolling.....
"I hate to go "home", to my parents, it’s a terrible place take me away, please don't take me home".
It seems that she called her mother twice from the States. The only thing her mother asked both times, was if MB has fixed the date for the wedding....the mother never asked how she was doing, if she was oke or happy.
But to satisfy the mother and to keep her quiet for some time, MB bought RB a lot of things it seems. A ring (greedy jewellery !!) was not possible unfortunately, because that was +/- $7500 or so....
MB knows of my existence, but still doesn’t know the truth. MB asked RB if the things that happened earlier (if I was/still am her love) were true....RB denied, simply because she had to.
In february she’ll go for the law-marriage. This time it was not possible. Hopefully her parents will let her go, cause they think the old fashion way (unmarried and boy-girl together if you know what I mean.....they’re even too late with that now). Also fixing her studies, etc. is needed in feb.
MB has to shift too begin next year. All the way to California. All these things and his own “problems” back home in India is taking a lot from him. They’re both in a fix, but are also blinded by it...
The last two day’s of RB’s staying MB had to go work for a couple of hours. RB got a bit angry with that.
MB doesn’t realize that RB is a woman who needs all the attention, because she’s very, very messed up and insecure by the whole thing. On the other hand, RB doesn’t realize that MB now has to start his career, and will have less time.....
Oh boy, oh boy.......anyone who can give me advise about what to do?
RB came with the impossible idea to run away with her, but that I cannot do....it’s not in my system and I cannot hurt MB, he did nothing wrong, simply because he doesn’t know.
I’ve quite some things to give to MB, should I give him the things? I’m talking about recordings and emails from RB.......but I don’t think he’ll survive it when he reads and listens to it.....not a second broken Asfar...no way......
I don’t know what to do anymore......I asked RB some time back not to tell me all the things and details anymore, because I cannot bear it anymore, especially because I love her like mad...and opposite.....
It’s better to hide certain things for me you know.....but on the other hand I’m the only one she has...I just know her too much and it’s too late to back off....
I’ll find a solution....
Asfar,
That is heavy duty emotional strain for you. There really are not a lot of options aside from running away or outright defiance to marry MB. The former is not an option for you, and the latter she cannot so it seems you are at the fork in the road once again. You said you cannot hurt MB, but in a way it will hurt you to imagine RB in his arms. So he is hurting you even if he is not knowingly doing it. RB's continual lying is not a good start, she will falter at some point because one cannot always keep the lies straight. i know, i have said "little white lies" and i always get caught up in the end. she is playing with fire and you are in the middle of it all. she has to be extremely careful right now; especially since he knows of your existence.
DO NOT send him anything you have on RB unless you want to sabotage the marriage. That would be so foolish on your part; how would you feel if your wife's exboyfriend sent you her emails etc.? would you not feel extreme jealousy and anger?
you are right, the less you know of the details, the better off your psyche will remain. aside from that what else can i say to u? every minute you see her now is torture and will continue until she's gone or you see it for yourself. you are in major denial and thats why you think quite erratically. what advice would you give to a friend of yours in the same fix? i hope that you could step out of your shoes to see the situation objectively enough to figure out what to do next. it is hard but no one else can do it for you.
Dear Missy Amrika,
"In february she’ll go for the law-marriage. This time it was not possible", I wrote......
Yesterday, in the evening, RB called me up...........:on the 15th RB & MB got married.........
She couldn't have the heart to tell me right after coming back she said. She thought that it'll really break my heart, but strangely enough it give me quite a relief.....I'm very surprised myself.......
Just before landing, she removed the wedding ring. I asked her why?
She just shouldn't have done that, and if it wasn't for me, not even for herself then: deciding to marry and really marrying itself, is something you have to support 200% if you decide to, if you do marry. A ring itself is just material, but it's the commitment, the promise you made to eachother. It's not THE, but a symbol to that....
But whatever will happen, hope everything will be oke for her....
"You said you cannot hurt MB, but in a way it will hurt you to imagine RB in his arms. So he is hurting you even if he is not knowingly doing it", that poor boy knows ABSOLUTELY NOTHING dear Missy Amrika...........how can I be mad or jealous at him? He knows about me, that's true......but that's all he knows......but he doesn't know the past. He knows that there is someone, a neighbor called "Asfar" who's crazy, who has a problem, who's mentally sick, and that's all.
No, if it was like that, if he knew all the things (who I am to RB and and what our past & present contains) and still willingly wants to "hurt" me by taking MB away (like her father does), then I would respond directly to him and make RB understand not to go ahead with things, just because I'm absolutely not the passive type of person, definitely not.
You know what dear Amrika, we'll see how life goes........time will show if life on earth isn't actually already the hell what people think of as the "hereafter"..........
Asfar,
I'm glad to hear you are not passive, but aside from your life and problems with RB are you mentally sick?
Asfar,
I'm happy yet sorry for you? The freedom you wanted for RB has arrived sooner than expected, maybe you will also find freedom in your heart. Do you have friends that you keep up with, nows the time to get in touch with them and keep busy. When does RB move to US and start her new life? Now go to your destiny and be a good person in your life. Above all be good to you first and foremost then you will be able to offer the best of you to another later on.
Take Care.
Dear Missy Amrika,
RB asked me to watch the movie "Hum dil de chuke sanam"....................
I never thought that a movie could reflect our story so well............indeed almost the complete story is like a mirror to the both of us...........
I didn't do anything wrong missy Amrika..........nor I'm mentally sick................
Everyone,
A merry & loving Christmas..........
Same best holiday wishes to u Asfar!
HEY DUDE! KEEP YOUR HEAD UP. A BRIGHTER DAY WILL COME. ALL THE BEST & A HAPPY NEW YEAR 2 U 2 HOPEFULLY.
Thanks Tina
i know deep down no matter what the guy has or doesnt have i cant marry or even be "fixed" with a guy that i dont love. Being 20 is a little too young for marriage and im definitely not ready yet i know that. See the people around us think that marrying/ being fixed with a fair guy 5'10 whos educated and rich will suddenly make me fall in love with him before he opens his mouth. So according to that logic one would be "in love" with him for his money so if he suddenly lost it all or went bankrupt or something you would move on to another rich guy ?? that is absurd what a load of bs. If you like him after a while then its different. I guess he would start to grow on you but then again either you have it initially or you dont. Raymond if its just a registration that RB had could you could get it annuled or something and return the ring ?
Dear Yasmeen,
You're very wise & sincere in your decision, somewhere I'm proud of you..............believe me.
Concerning the marriage of RB: she has to do/decide things on herself too. I cannot be there always.......I'm the one who has to go further to with living. Love or no love between RB & MB.......I can't nor won't do anything anymore.......I just don't have the energy anymore.
I could only hope that RB had the freedom & the capacity to decide such an important decision, in and for her own life, by herself.........just like you did.
It's really not a joke Yasmeen: it's my and RB's death otherwise............it really will be if her father comes to know that we're still in contact, and worse: that we're still in love.............
There shouldn't be another movie called: Mohabbetein part 2 !!!!!
Raymond you said "I'm the one who has to go further to with living." what do you mean ?
Dear Yasmeen,
What I mean to say is that RB's future is already fixed for her now, willingly or not !!
I on the other hand cannot sit still at this point, crying, being hurt and think that this is the end of my life now: I have to go on too, go on with my life and make the best out of it........if love comes again or not in my life............
Hey that was coincidence im glad i came back here before i logged off since i didnt think you would write something up in the meantime !! Are you sure that you have lost RB forever or are you perhaps assuming things ? Does RB have a choice in this "fixing" can she pull out of it now could she say no ? MAybe you're putting yourself through unnecessary torture if in fact you havent lost RB at all and you think that because of either an assumption or overreaction. There is a light at the end of the tunnel and dont lose hope until you're crystal clear about where you and your gf really are. HAve you actually been able to talk to her lately alone i.e without her parents or other people around and had a heart to heart spill ??
Dear Yasmeen,
Every day we talk multiple times over the telephone and almost every day we meet outside.
RB could step out of this forced arranged marriage, but not without the consequences mentioned earlier: her father will kill her for sure, her mother, her brother and me. Believe me, this isn't just fiction.
I wish I could give you some telephone-conversations that I recorded, RB herself explains it the best and I KNOW how sick her father is and what he's capable of. And frankly speaking Yasmeen: I don't want to lower myself to these kind of retarded third world behaviour.................
raymond,
sober up. both of you are heading for a disastrous miserable end. actions of both of you are not going to provide peace in your lives. i think you need to settle down. if you (both) looking for peace, be mature, wake up! end this affair, put yourself together and move on to your real destination-a peaceful and purposeful life. good luck.
Kadir,
I think you are actually on your way to healing yourself by your latest postings! What a surprise. Only you can help yourself since you know all that occurred, how to overcome etc. Just curious, do you know where in California MB will be moving to? And if he knows of this website are you not afraid he will read here and know this is his wife and ex we are discussing?
I am glad you are beginning to find relief finally, and there will be much more of this in the new year. Are you still in classes to "better yourself" as you wrote earlier?
Raymond why dont both of you run away or something if thats the last option you have left to stay together ?
good luck people!
Too win a game - Play it by its rules
Arranged Marriages - are for people who totally believe in it from the bottom of thier heart. You should believe that marriages are made in Heaven. You should trust the judgement of the elders and your instincts. You should be willing to compromise if its not 100% fit and focus on the good points. You should be a person who has not had many affairs ( preferably - never had affair or sex).
If you opt for love marriage - follow its rules too..dont just date a few times and decide to get married. Have a prolonged dating period..live together for a while if possible.
Arrange love marriage- are we trying to play two games at the same time. Or is it a new game..
Good points Ajay, i agree with you.
Is this page closed?
Raymond
I opened this page for the first time . I read your story and also came to know about diffrent views from Missy amrica ,simran etc.
I am feeling very sorry for your unblieveabla and misrable love story. I too got love cum arrang marriage .
Me and my hasband were class mates . But there was nothing between us when we were together ,just good friends .But when we finished our study ,both of us started to feel something for each other. I invited him at one of our family functions coz our parents knew that we were just good friends .But we were something else for eachother now . Fortunatly his mum also came with him .After one month she talked to my mother on phone to give a marriage perposal .Our casts were not same. It was a big problem.But after sometime my parents relized that it would be good for our loving daughter's happiness so they agreed.At last we got married.Now we are living happily for last year.We met in 1993 and got married in 2000.
I wited for seven years for him to earn his living.
Now my parents and my in laws are very happy.
Raymond now i want to know about your RB's marriage.IS she happily married now ?What did happen after her marriage? How are you living without your love? These are some questions to which i would like to know the answer.I am so curious .
waiting for your reply.
Ruby
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