| By Soothsayer on Thursday, July 08, 1999 - 07:26 am: |
hey guys, I've been reading your messages and find them pretty interesting. Princess, you stand out. What do you look like? Which gets me to my point. Was watching Ally McBeal the other day, and my favourite character, Richard Fish, said yet another great line: "Women were born to be the objects of male sexual desire, even if they don't admit it." Now, for all those of you who are dropping your mouths open and huffing in indignation: COME ON! You men out there know what I am talking about. We want women. Good-looking women. Women with beautiful hair, smiles and bodies. As for you women, you might not admit it but you do feel flattered when men pay attention. Decades of feminism has not changed that. It's biological. Women are evolutionarily meant to be pursued by men. Men will pursue ATTRACTIVE women. So for you arranged-marriage guys checking out photos from India, keep this in mind. You can cook. You can clean. You can bring in enough money for the two of you. You can read a book if you want intelligent thoughts. But you are going to be waking up to that face and that body FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE. That you cannot change. Hey, sex is great and women are awesome - take it from someone who knows. The truth is: beauty matters and it matters a lot. You might not like hearing it, but then, few people appreciate the truth. My love to the ladies (esp. Princess, you sound hot).
| By Princess on Friday, July 09, 1999 - 07:24 am: |
Soothsayer,
To a point you are right about the biological approaches to the opposite sex. Sure women love it when men watch them however it isn't flattering when someone says nasty things to you when you are walking down the street minding your own beeswax.
Your idea of beauty and what one should look for in a wife is rather shallow however you are entitled to it. Remember we reap what we sow. One can cook and clean and read if the woman is good looking and dumb and lazy but how long is he going to wake up doing that? And what happens when she gets fat or grows warts? Beauty is indeed skindeep and can be lost instantly. Nothing is forever but your mind and your qualities always are.
| By bhopad on Friday, July 09, 1999 - 05:38 pm: |
Well said Princess..you are solely responsible for my improving expectation from women folk now. You see this is the problem..unless you meet women with your mental character and trait, you feel they are all objects wanting security, safety, comfort and a wealthy enough husband to spend money on shopping. You are not to blame if most women folk are like that but you guys are so far and few that we men have almost accepted that there are no such women existing. You see what you have cannot be developed after marriage it has to be a part of you before it.
| By Princess on Saturday, July 10, 1999 - 02:45 am: |
Bhopad,
In this day and age women aren't in the ultratraditional roles that were part of them many decades ago. Today they are moving up and encountering a world that not only requires them to think for themselves but also speak for themselves. Why wouldn't an educated mature woman not expect the same that she gives to a man in a relationship? Why if she can work, make money, take care of the house, cook and be a good wife and sexual partner can't she expect the same from her significant other?
Our only obsticles are our minds and when we learn to free them off the thoughts that prevent us from progressing everything falls into place and comes into perspective. I learn something new everyday and I think there is so much to learn, I will continue to do so until the day I die. I think as humans we find it easier to turn our heads away from a situation and justify it by pretending it doesn't exist.
| By TouchTalk on Wednesday, September 01, 1999 - 03:47 pm: |
Don't know if I'm going to help this discussion but I only discovered the site this week and I'm getting carried away with posting...!
(Confession time first: I'm white and English - but that might help add a different perspective..)
The question posed could easily be more broadly applied to men and women in general - as was hinted at in the introduction. We're all God's children before we're anything else...
Physically attractive women are, on the whole, sexually attractive. And many 'ordinary looking' women are also sexually attractive because their personalities make them so. Put an attractive (physically or intellectually attractive) woman in front of a man and his thoughts will inevitably turn to sex.
What seperates men/women from beasts is that we can realise the attraction but not act on it if we so choose. A good friend of mine - Indian, as it happens - is a very good-looking girl with an outgoing and attractive personality. For reasons not worth going into here, she and I would not be suited romantically. If she were to want to explore a physical relationship with me then, although the temptations would be enormous, I believe that, becasue I truly value the friendship, I would not risk it by indulging my carnal desires...
Maybe the compromise has to be that because people will inevitably find their other-sex (or even their same-sex?) friends to be sexually attractive it is their attitude towards the relationship that will determine whether or not they can actually be friends.
I think that Sincerely makes a very good point about getting to know men - to do that, you've got to have male friends. And, more to the point, these must be strictly platonic male friends where he has no expectation whatsoever of ever sleeping with you... *then* you get him as he is. For that reason alone men and women should strive to be friends. I think both sexes can learn an awful lot from each other when they don't have to maintain an image....
TouchTalk
| By Anonymous on Saturday, September 11, 1999 - 11:29 pm: |
TouchTalk:
Well said.
| By Soleina on Thursday, September 16, 1999 - 09:30 am: |
Hi,
This is the first time that i come in this site, and i found it very interessting.
I'm 22 indian born women, i raised in France.
I think that men and women could be friends if they are both clear with their fellings.
I have a lot of men friends, some of them try to go out with me, but they aren't all the same.
As i'm a very open minded girl , i know that it's human and natural that some of friends are attract by me, but i think that if you have got good relations and you don't want to involve in something else it's not difficult to say to them!!!
ok, hope to read others interessting advices and everything else!!
Bye
| By chhonu on Saturday, September 25, 1999 - 12:45 am: |
Soleina,
Your views are nice like cuban coffee short,sweet and Strong.
But I have seen majority of persons are not able to control their feelings. It may be natural.
I have many friends they are female, some of them are clear about there feelings and some of them are not regardless they married or unmarried.
One incident realy socked me, It was from my girlfriends friend, One day she proposed me and
wanted me sleep with her. Offcourse she is more beautiful. Any how I managed to get out from that room.
After this incident, I always keep good distance from such kind of opposite sex friends.
Good distance means, never allow them to pour there unwanted feelings on you.
| By Princess on Saturday, September 25, 1999 - 06:04 pm: |
Chonnu,
Running away from a situation is not something an adult would do. The way you describe things is that just up and leave when you face a conflict. It is ofcourse natural for man or woman to have feelings at some point in time towards eachother. There is nothing unhealthy about that. The phrase friend make the best lovers didn't come from nowhere.
However for some people this is not a feasible situation and people should sit down and discuss the issue if the friendship is important not skirt the issue. Distance doesn't mean physically being away from someone, true distance is mental while maintaining the close physical distance. True distance is being able to tell the difference between how far something will go or won't.
Good distance is not "never allowing them to pour their unwanted feelings on you". If tomorrow my best friend starts having feelings towards me I damn right will sit down with him and talk it out not run away from him, because I care for him and his friendship. Any friendship one has to "run away" from isn't really a friendship then is it?
Boundries aren't set in a relationship when you get to that point but rather in the course of a frienship. How we establish our relationship and what kind of signals we give out is important because that is the difference between someone falling from you and knowing you aren't interested.
| By Voice of Reason on Wednesday, September 29, 1999 - 04:01 am: |
Do you people read this crap above? Do you read what you write? You are all talking about relationships and just about every one of you has sexual overtones in each message. Are you people that sexually frustrated that you can't get to the point and lay it on the line? Get a life.
If you want to discuss relationships, then do so. Why does every conversation involve sexual discussion or the mention that you "aren't talking about sex." Look, talk about relationships if you want to. But if you want to talk about sex, then do so. These people are grown ups, they can discuss sex maturely. My guess is that the majority of you are repressed and have little or no sex. If you are another ethnicity, then comment appropriately here.
But remember, this is for people of Indian culture and heritage. I am an Indian, 27 years old, and have lived in America for 10 years. My father is a pediatrician and my mother a housewife. I am completely Americanized but behold my culture. However, I do not let my culture prevent me from living and doing what I want. If I want to have sex, guess what, I have sex.
I don't fret that it is not tolerated by the culture. But this is America. As my very insulting American friend says, "get on the clue bus." I am not embarrassed by anything. No, I do not surf porn sites and go to chat rooms. I do not have AOL.
I came across this site through a search and wanted to see about "relationship chat". I think the most important thing is to stop talking on the web about relationships and just do it. You are talking on the web with complete strangers about a topic that they can't assist with. These are people that are likely sexual deviants. I have literally read every phrase and this is what I have gathered that people want to say: "I love having sex with Indian women/men. I love being with Indian Men because of how large they are. And we are. I love being with Indian women because of their intense desire to please and be pleased. I love how they can handle all of my length. American girls can't handle that much.
In closing, Princess, you seem like a person that surfs in this site much too often. Get a life. You also seem like the general little bee keeper of comments and conversation. Liberate everyone. If you are Indian and have reservations, stop. Go out and drink a beer, watch a football game, blow off class, blow off your over-bearing parents, and have sex. Who knows, you may feel more comfortable with yourself and not inhibited self. If you have additional comments, just call me the voice of reason.
| By Heidi on Wednesday, September 29, 1999 - 07:41 pm: |
Yo, "Voice of Reason"-
That is pretty presumptuous of you to step in and try to judge everyone on this board. How are you different from them? It looks to me like you just came here to let us all know that you are Indian and have lots of sex, so you must be oh-so-cool.
I find all this talk of women's body hair offensive. Some people are hairier than others, and so what? Women have no obligation to shave or not shave any part of their body to please men or social norms. "White Guy" sounds like a creep for complaining about Indian women being hairy, and "Voice of Reason" sounds like a creep for saying that hairy white women look trashy. By the way, I didn't think the previous question was necessarily referring to pubic hair, as Mr. V.O.R. assumed. And I don't see how it has anything to do with culture. So far as I know, most American women shave their legs and underarms. Many Indian women shave their arms as well, which is unusual in America. In much of Europe, women don't shave at all. As far as who does or doesn't shave their pubic hair, I cannot speak for anyone besides myself, and I don't care. What does any of this signify? Nothing! It's all a matter of personal taste and personal choice. And don't pick on Princess! She's probably busy right now creating a new section for us to talk about body hair. =)
| By Princess on Wednesday, September 29, 1999 - 08:38 pm: |
"In closing, Princess, you seem like a person that surfs in this site much too often. Get a life. You also seem like the general little bee keeper of comments and conversation. Liberate everyone. If you are Indian and have reservations, stop. Go out and drink a beer, watch a football game, blow off class, blow off your over-bearing parents, and have sex. Smoke some pot. Who knows, you may feel more comfortable with yourself and not inhibited self. If you have additional comments, just call me the voice of reason. "
Hon you sound like one of the sexually supressed people you are accussing of having no life on here! Don't take cheap shots at me. You don't know me from the nail on the wall and I'm not one of the idi0ts that comes on this board and perpetuates this kind of behavior. I try to prevent it. If you would bother to read anything I've ever written you wouldn't make such an ignorant statement.
Now that you've gotten your frustration out I hope you are happy. Find yourself some mental help, you sound like you need it. If you have nothing frutiful to add to an already deteriorating forum stay out.
Sure what White Guy said was absolutely "irrelevant" and "improperly worded" however it doesn't make it free country for you to bash others that had nothing to do with his discussion or the topic. But people like you indulge this kind of behavior and by responding to it in the most ridiculous way by telling him "all Indian women are hairy" you've perpetuated this type of behaviour and are just as guilty of promoting this type of absurd discussions.
Didn't your mother teach you "if you have nothing nice to say, don't!"
This board is going to the dogs thanx to people like you and White guy. You are right about one thing...everything has a sexual overtone! Which is sad. But even does your message!
| By Voice of Reason on Thursday, September 30, 1999 - 12:52 am: |
Test successful. I stated what I wanted and checked to see if busy bee commented - and she did - immediately.
It is the spontaneity that keeps you alive and interesting, not your adherence to tradition and convention. The exciting people are the people that break the rules every now and then. They are the people that do not spend all their free time writing to strangers on bulletin boards and chat rooms (much like I am doing but I needed a break from an extremely ruthless day of trading. This reminds me of my liberal arts classes - it was always the unhappy and meek that drove the conversation.) Anyway, my advice is to party, and be merry with friends. --------Voice of Reason
| By Editor on Thursday, September 30, 1999 - 01:56 am: |
Dear Voice of Reason
Your 3 postings as follow:
White Guy [September 28 - 06:20 pm]
Why are Indian women.. ?
Voice of Reason [September 28 - 10:01 pm]
Do you people read this crap above? Do
Voice of Reason [September 29 - 06:52 pm]
Test successful. I stated what I
Your postings are not in conformity with the style of these boards and highly objectionable.
We do not appreciate such obscene language or personal attacks on anyone.
Your postings are from ONE single machine and we do record complete information of the posters.
Most people who post here are free to post in the limits of decency and your pontification or objection is undesirable.
This is a public site and it is moderated by Mr. Pk Kapila and assisted by a small editorial team.
If you have any questions you can reach him or the webmaster@hindustan.net
If you do not apologize or write a clear worded message with your intentions we will be deleting your messages as unworthy.
You have no rights to attack people nor anyone is intersted in such talk.
We are NOT here to judge anyone.
| By Impressed and Apologetic on Thursday, September 30, 1999 - 02:19 am: |
Then take the messages off. I do not visit this site and yes, have contributed little to the goal of the forum, other than what would be experienced in a upper level philosophy/liberal arts course at University.
But I do agree, sometimes up-front and challenging conversation is unnecessary in certain situations. My lack of understanding regarding the parameters of the site is obvious. I believe the nature of my conversation stems from my disdain for the sick who polute so many chat rooms and bulletin boards with dysfunctional and sexual garbage. I have found that the majority of conversants in these sites are dysfunctional. Thank you and I hope you achieve what you set out for with this site.
From time to time though, you should analyze the conversation and determine its point, integrity, and its origin, as you have slyly done here. I'm glad you pay attention to IPs. Very sly. Good night.
| By Editor on Thursday, September 30, 1999 - 02:44 am: |
Dear Voice of Reason
We appreciate your prompt response and understood your logic.
We will not delete your messages however objectionable portions will be edited so that other people do not get upset.
You are most welcome to discuss, start discussions, write whatever comes to your mind and expect good feedback. Kindly do not indulge in provocative language or personal attacks unless you have a solid reason to do so.
We have over 600 different topics related to Indians in India and indian communities worldwide.
Your personal experiences, ideas and frustrations can be valuable to others if you care to share.
You are most welcome and invited to share your ideas.
If you have any suggestions for us please write to the moderator or editor or webmaster @ hindustan.net
| By Lost In Space on Friday, October 01, 1999 - 09:12 am: |
Hi All!
I'll tell you about something thats going on in my life right now as a story..........
Theres a guy and a girl who are good "friends".... then the guy realises one day that he likes the girl as more than a friend...he thinks the world of her.
The girl "thinks" she feels "something" but more than anything else its just a friendship for her....
The girl feels they should just stay friends and the guy strongly feels the total opposite....
The guy cannot handle the fact that she might start liking another guy in future....and himself cannot be so close friends with her if he starts liking another girl....
Can they still be friends???
What should they do???
They could just stop seeing each other as friends but thats not what either party want....
Is it possible to just remain friends if there is some chemistry and fairly strong feelings there?
Please help!
Princess, Joseph, Rayna - or anyone else!
Thankx for listening....
| By FunLover on Friday, October 01, 1999 - 03:40 pm: |
Lost in space
Although you have not asked for advice, as it is free I'll give it to you! I have been there and I am sure it will help.
Alas your friend has been trapped in a "Just in case" situation. Some women indulge in it every so often. Believe me I have been there! They tell me they want to be friends with me. And when after going through the dating game she tells me that I am her best friend and feels very comfy with me. When I suggest that we can get more comfy in private she tells me that she wants to be good friends with me. And that we should not get intimate. When I say that my intentions are a bit more deeper than that she says she "likes"
me and still wants to be friends. But when I say OK lets break up so that we can find someone else, she says that I am her best friend and she is not sure so, we should NOT stop seeing each other.Sound familiar?
You know where this is leading to? SHE IS KEEPING ME AROUND "JUST IN CASE..."!!!
The only way to break from this "let's just be friends" game is make a clean break. Start seeing another person. If your friend really likes her as a friend he can go back to hanging with her (NOT DATING) with her AFTER he has found someone who wants something more than "friendship".
It is fine for a man and a woman to be just friends. But is not really sensible in carrying on the relationship at that level if one is attracted to another or they are both attracted to each other. They should talk, Iron out the glitches and get married or become lovers.
| By Princess on Friday, October 01, 1999 - 09:38 pm: |
Lost in Space,
It's natural and human to be attracted to friends. If we weren't "attracted" and drawn to them we wouldn't make friends with them. The expression "friends make the best lovers" does have meaning. Whenever people come upon such hurdles in a friendship it's ofcourse going to cause confusion and turmoil. If the feeling is mutual then everything is hunky dory. However if it isn't and the two friends really care for eachother they should keep it in perspective and deal with it. If someone is so attracted to someone and it hinders his honstly being friends with her then he should move on and respect her wishes if she isn't interested.
Time often plays out our actions and people eventually are able to get a grip on themselves. Rejection is something that will happen often in life in different phases. Mutual respect is extremely important. Most often friendships sort themselves out and make or break in such situations. So either the persons move on or learn to live with it and eventually forget about it.
My advise to you is, don't pressure her into something she doen't willing want to get into, not matter how strongly you feel she's madly in love with you! That's unethical. Be her friend as much as you can if you want, if it's difficult to be around her just as a friend then move on and find yourself another friend. I know it sounds cold and harsh but be practical and think about yourself first. Good luck.
| By Opinion on Saturday, October 02, 1999 - 06:08 pm: |
Lost In Space,
Being a woman I have been in the other shoe.
From a woman's perspective... She definately likes you, however, woman are slow at realizing love and other things. They require some sort of security or sureness that relationship is going in the positive direction before they will take a plunge or make a next move.
Have you openly communicated with her...exactly how you feel? No, "golmatol" conversation...simply being direct and laying it on the line?
Her reservations may become apparent once you have had an open dialogue. There are and could be multitude of things that can be influencing her decision. Just to speculate few... i.e. Her age, past experiences, family expectations, up bringing, her own real/imagined fears and many more.
Give her some time... let her have some SPACE... give her some room and time to realize and think about what you have discussed with her your feelings.
I think if love/attraction is strong enough between two of you, with the help of open communication these things can be resolved.
Don't give up on LOVE so quickly. It does not come/happen around frequently.
| By Help! on Monday, October 04, 1999 - 09:58 pm: |
This reminds me of something similar I went thru.
V… (We) worked closely together in a small office. He was married and I am single. Of coarse, as time elapsed we got to know each other better, even though friendship did not start off on the right foot, because our views were vastly different. I have been raised in the US and he was raised in India. I started to sense that our friendship meant much more to him than it meant for me. For me… first being a woman, two, respecting another Indian sister (his wife) and three, respecting his marital status I would not allow any deviation of thoughts to enter my mind. I am NOT a saint and being a human being…realizing the temptations one might be subjected to…I decided to take appropriate steps and remove myself from the situation and first I started to avoid it as much as possible.
However, events turned out such that he left for India for vacation and I was transferred to a different place.
I thought I had communicated to him…about our friendship and made it clear of what it was. I thought he understood what I said. However, when I recognized his feelings and signs…I was speechless…confused…and could not say the right things…because I didn’t want to hurt him. I basically, did not say anything or do anything.
Did I do the right thing? What should I have done differently? Perhaps, he will realize in time… that it was just an attraction and nothing meaningful that could impact anyone adversely (his wife).
However, this incidence has left me in a confused state… Harsh reality…There are NO gurantees in life… Hopefully, I will find a right husband that I can put my faith and trust in. and will not abuse that. Certainly, it would be a gross mis-judgement on my part to pick a person…to share my life with and he turns out to be heart breaker.
Scary Huh?
Question:
(1) How can I be somewhat assured or the steps I can take to make sure… this kinds of things does not happen in my marriage?
(2) How many % of married men cheat…sexually or non-sexually?
| By Anonymous on Tuesday, October 05, 1999 - 12:46 am: |
There are all kinds of people out there. Here is my take on your situation. Unless it is mutually agreed upon by husband and wife. Society does not look too kindly upon this type of WRONG behavior (cheating).
Some people have loose values and beliefs of what is RIGHT and what is WRONG?
What is MORAL and what is ETHICAL?
Perhaps, it is an issue of conscious. Some have no regard as to how it may impact another human being his WIFE.
Person's upbringing…
Selfish behavior with concern of only his pleasure. This type of men give a bad rap to Indian family values and Indian culture.
No self restraint or inhibition to wrongful inappropriate acts. Classic case of -- Wanting best of both worlds. Could be looked upon as an anti-social behavior--- an inability of a person to follow societal norms.
Their thinking may be Do the RIGHT thing? What's that? Totally a warped idea of sacred marriage and committed monogomous relationship.
Marriage is a decision, not a feeling. A good relationship is work and nothing less. Who said it would be bliss? life comes with consequences.
Well, as a friend try to explain him, what he is doing is not right. He may not even realize it or may be getting carried away or could be a mis understanding. He may not like your directness but it is ultimately in his best interest. That's what friends are for. To share good and bad. I am sure you would want him to do the same if you were married and doing wrong things.
| By Lost In Space on Wednesday, October 06, 1999 - 08:35 am: |
Hi All!
First of all I just wanna say thank you to FunLover, Princess and Opinion for responding to my post.....your comments were much appreciated! :-)
I have to say that you guys have given me three totally different views on my situation but its opened up my mind a little and together, you've all helped me to "progress" from the state I was in before.......
FunLover - I understand exactly what you're saying and where you're coming from but I really DON'T think that she's keeping me hanging for a "just in case" scenario.....
Princess - To be honest I didn't really understand your advice till I thought about it properly, now I realise what you mean and I guess I've thought about what you said - just to move on and get on with things, fair enough this sounds like the "right thing to do" but it is difficult and I really do believe that she likes me (I'm not just saying that because I want to believe it!) ....okay how about the fact that we BOTH enjoy talking to each other and spending time with each other?
If things don't seem to work out as "friends" then I suppose I'll have to take some action and this will go along the lines of your advice....
Opinion - Thank you so much for your advice! I really agree with you on what you said and I know that this kind of friendship/relationship doesn't come by everyday, so I will give it time and space and hopefully things will work out!
I have told her exactly how I feel and maybe that shocked her! Open communication is one of the things I strongly believe in...
Maybe there are reasons for her to keep some distance for the time being but it doesn't exactly make sense when she keeps on contacting me or wanting to meet up all the time!
I don't know but I know that I will give it time and see what happens, only time will tell!
Thanks again!
Signing Outta Here!...
| By Opinion on Saturday, October 09, 1999 - 11:40 pm: |
Lost in Space,
One of your comment said:"
Maybe there are reasons for her to keep some distance for the time being but it doesn't exactly make sense when she keeps on contacting me or wanting to meet up all the time!
She thinks of you as her good friend and we call, talk to and see our friends. Don't we? Don't you? Most of us see and talk to our frineds. What's the big deal?
Just wanted to point out that it is a normal behavior for a friend to call and see his/her friends.
Hey...if it bothers you and you don't want to hear from her than tell her to stop calling.
Hope things will work out for you!
| By WASP on Sunday, October 10, 1999 - 10:38 pm: |
That guy was just being a jerk about
mentioning body hair, but what about
body hair? I think that there are
few men out there who would like to
date or marry a woman with hairy
underarms/legs.
For me, when looking for a mate,
weight is negotiable and no serious
hurdle in itself. However, body hair
is a definate "deal-breaker."
YUCK!
| By Lost In Space on Monday, October 11, 1999 - 07:23 am: |
Opinion.....
Hi there! I just wanted to clear something that I don't think I said very well first time round....
The part when I said that she keeps contacting me and wanting to meet up....okay that is perfectly normal in friendship.....thats fine....
BUT, is it normal to call a friend 5 times a day?
Is it normal to think of each other all the time?
Where do you draw the line between friendship and a relationship???
| By Princess on Monday, October 11, 1999 - 04:05 pm: |
Lost in Space,
The line between friendship and a relationship is as visible as you make it. In other words, because you have feelings for her the line seems blurry to you. In her world she may be acting quite normally. There are no hard and fast rules. The lines are what you make up with your own dynamics in the relationship. If it seems excessive to you, past friendship, tell her and put an end to it. She may be completely unaware and you may be inadvertently building sandcastles in the dark, hoping for a good outcome. Don't do anything that will hurt you in the long run.
| By Anon on Monday, October 11, 1999 - 11:05 pm: |
Now that is what I call advice! Listen to her Lost In Space.
| By Opinion on Tuesday, October 12, 1999 - 02:06 am: |
Lost in Space,
BUT, is it normal to call a friend 5 times a day?
That depends on what you talk about. Gooshy mooshy stuff or every day small talk?
Is it normal to think of each other all the time?
Did she say...she was thinking of you? If so, what about? Gooshy mooshy stuff about you two or as a friend who cares for you?
simply... ask her... would not that be easier than speculating?
| By Opinion on Tuesday, October 12, 1999 - 02:10 am: |
Lost in Space,
On a more lighter note...
Isn't there a Hindi song...that goes something like this...
"Peh le aap, Phe le aap kar ne se gadi nikel gi yegi?".
something like that...
| By Lost In Space on Tuesday, October 12, 1999 - 09:25 am: |
Hi All!
Princess - Usually (with other friends that are girls), I do keep a certain distance and they just know where the line is because I make it clear and people don't cross that "line"....
But with her its just so different. She has already crossed the line, maybe not knowingly like you've said but I feel as if there is more to it not only from my side but from her side too.....
Its not as if I'm unsure because she HAS told me that she does like me but isn't sure if she wants to go further because of her family and fear that they might not accept me or may not like the idea of her dating a guy.....it would have to be kept a secret but thats the same on my part too.
I am now starting to look more on the lines of keeping the friendship as it is and not taking things further but it is difficult. One thing I definitely know is that I can't stand to lose her as a friend because we just get on so well.
I feel that if two people like each other enough, they would put aside all else (within reason) and fight for the right to be together.....and if thats not going to happen then maybe its best if it doesn't even begin.
After hearing advice from all of you guys and chatting to a few friends it has eased the situation a lot for me and I've been able to think things through more clearly....thanks!
Opinion.....I understand where you're coming from but you just won't know unless you listen to the way we talk to each other and how happy BOTH of us are every time we meet and chat....I can't explain it anymore but in my books two friends don't call each other 5 times a day every single day....its just not on and thats the "line" that has been crossed already...
It is not necessary for me to ask her if she thinks about me, I just know and this is not speculation!! She sometimes tells me that she was thinking about me.
...and for the record we don't talk "Gooshy mooshy stuff"!!
Thanks for the advice though!
And thank you Princess....your advice makes sense and I respect it....thankx!
| By FunLover on Tuesday, October 12, 1999 - 05:05 pm: |
Go talk to her dude. It may work out. If it does not you will atleast know.
Have fun
| By Opinion on Tuesday, October 12, 1999 - 07:37 pm: |
Lost in Space:
When I said "Gooshy mooshy stuff" I didn't mean sexual in nature. I meant romantic...sweet loving things. :-) makes ones heart melt.
That's all.
| By Lost In Space on Wednesday, October 13, 1999 - 06:38 am: |
Opinion....
Thank you for clarifying what you meant. I admit I thought you were referring to something different.
FunLover - I am planning to talk to her soon....I just need to find the right time.
I don't yet know where I'm heading but I feel that I am not doing the right thing by seeing her all the time as "friends" when I clearly know that its more for me.
If it comes to it, then I think I will try to keep a distance and make sure she knows where the "line" is...
Maybe Princess was right in saying that I should just leave it and stop seeing her...
I don't know!!!
| By Opinion on Wednesday, October 13, 1999 - 09:21 pm: |
Lost in Space,
Since you talk with her 5 times a day. In one of your 5 conversation, you should find a courage to ask her, and you will KNOW the answer.
| By Lost In Space on Tuesday, October 19, 1999 - 12:24 pm: |
Hello everyone!
This is my last post to this board....
I just wanted to say that I've had an opportunity to think things through properly and I have a clearer picture of where I am going with this relationship......
"We" always talk openly and its not as if we haven't already discussed anything thats been brought up so far!
We are going to get to know each other more and just wait and see how things develop....
I feel this is the best way to go and just wanted to say thanx to everyone for all the advice!
Much appreciated! :-)
| By Leena on Wednesday, November 10, 1999 - 12:43 pm: |
I'm not really sure whether real, meaningful friendships between Indian men and women are possible. I do have a lot of guy friends, one of whom is Indian. The few times I've tried for a more meaningful friendship, something usually gets in the way. Usually, it's in the form of other Indian friends of ours beginning to comment on how much time we spend around each other. I feel like sometimes that's done just because people talk, and a couple times it's happened because I was trying to be intimidated into going out on a date with the guy in question ("everyone's talking about us, they expect to see us out and about...")
Hmm. I'm wondering whether this why I've never really dated Indian guys? I'm definitely one for knowing the person as a person and as a friend before it gets definted (mutually) it as a dating-relationship...and it seems my few experiences with Indian guys, they wanted to define it as a dating-committing-to-something-more almost immediately!
Anyway. My $0.02.
Leena
| By Funlover on Thursday, November 11, 1999 - 03:34 am: |
Leena,
Actually there is something I am not getting here, generally speaking. I agree that you may have not met a compatible Indian guy. But why do we come to these conclusions that all Indian guys are the same? No, you did not say that. But when you said "I'am really not sure ....friendship between Indian men and women is not possible" the connotation is that you believe that it is not possible. And when this kind of relationship is not possible between Indian men and women something is truly wrong with us. As other races, who you have noticed, can do it. This is the conclusion one comes to from your statement. This belief is based on a couple of encounters you have had. But, basing your beliefs on a few encounters is what leads to prejudice. This may come as shocker to you but that is what it is.
I don't know much about you. This is your first post of yours I am reading. But I am pretty sure that you are dating a non-Indain man, or atleast thinking of it. Nothing wrong with that. But please don't insult our intelligence by blaming it on us (Indian men/Indian women(who commented on you)) for YOU chosing to date some one who you like. If you're not dating a non-Indian, I stand chastised.
Actually there were quite a few times when I was hanging out with non-indian girls when my non-indian friends did ask/comment on that. It happened with Indian women too. Again there is something I don't understand. Isn't it the same everywhere? When a girl and a guy hang out with each other people do ask questions. Especially friends. I have gone to school here and it happens here too. Do you mean to say that the non-Indian friends never ask you about your relatioship/make comments about the guy who you are hanging out with? My experiences have proven otherwise. Especially in school, when we are more informal with each other.
If a guy tries to intimidate you, I agree with you. But the excuse this guy gave was pathetic, not intimidating. We again come back to the same question. How many experiences does it take to prove that something is wrong with a people?
None, if we want to believe something is wrong with them. Not any, if we don't want to believe it.
Funlover
| By Leena on Friday, November 12, 1999 - 01:28 pm: |
Funlover,
Aren't you being a bit harsh? You just took one thread of what I've said, isolated it, drawn a conclusion, and then attacked my point of view.
"the connotation is that you believe that it is not possible..."
Actually, what I said is that I'm *not* *sure* whether it's possible or not. The jury's still out, as far as I'm concerend. I'm simply not sure.
I know you to be a pretty reasonable poster, from other discussion threads I've seen you on. And I'd be therefore happy to share more that might shed light on my perspective.
It's rather difficult to do that, however, if I feel like my every point of view and perspective is being attacked, especially since (by your own admission!) this is the first post of mine you're reading, and don't know that much about me. It would've been a lot nicer to have questions asking for clarification rather than a "how could you say that, you're so wrong!!"
I really enjoy posting here, and especially reading stuff that the regulars like you, Princess, Sincerely, Dexter, and others have to say. I truly believe this forum is great way to exchange ideas and learn about one another. I'd like to feel welcome here, I don't want to feel like you're judging me without knowing me. I'd like to be sure of my surroundings before I share anything more, however, so would you please let me know what exactly you have questions about? I'd be happy to respond.
BTW, please forgive me if I've misread the intent of your posts the way I feel you've misread mine...it is, after all, possible in the virtual world.
Leena
| By akashika on Tuesday, November 23, 1999 - 10:22 am: |
hey everybody!!
Its really nice toread all ur advises and comments and prob.s here.........
Man and woman can be good frenz......and if they cannot be good frenz, they cannot be good lovers or married couple......so all those people out ther' who r scared of this and gettin' hurt.....etc.....CHILL!
Life is beautiful, ............someday somewhere, sometime in ur life ......we all would realise that ther' is someone special herer......
any comments???
SOMEBODY
| By Muscle Man on Tuesday, November 23, 1999 - 11:08 am: |
Dear akashika,
I agree with your comments about someone finding the right person in their life.
But people have a problem about who this person will be or when they will come. What are you going to do if you have missed this person?
| By muk on Thursday, May 04, 2000 - 03:17 pm: |
Hi
i am muk from bangalore i have got my own business
my hight is 5.6 wheght 75 good looking smart and i am
looking a good friend if you can email me i will be
happy to meet a good friend like you my email add is
muk_g@usa.net
| By TheThinkingMachine on Tuesday, August 22, 2000 - 09:06 pm: |
Man and Woman(Indian or whatever)can be friends.I don't think there is a problem with that.The 'sex' thing will always be there,even if you don't acknowledge it ,its always there underneath,the fact is people of opposite sex do meet and do talk to each other because it is romantic and interesting and fun Given a choice between a boyfriend and a girlfriend,(and on the assumption that both are equally good or bad), I will most probably go for the girl ,and most people above i am sure will do what i have done.The fact is she is a girl and that makes all the difference,admit it.And if the 'girl friend' permits it,most 'boy friends' of the said 'girl friends' will take advantage of her.(that is,if she's going to say let's have sex,most so called boyfriends will
do it,there will be very few who wouldn't take advantage of the situation).
Admit it guys,the 'sex' factor is there,if you don't believe me check the profiles of the members in this site, 90% are of the 'man seeking women' type or 'woman seeking men' type.Very few are of type 'penfriendship'.And note it ,its not simply one woman/man that a person is seeking ,its any number of women/men!
| By dollar1000 on Thursday, August 31, 2000 - 10:32 pm: |
Well, it is difficult in our society to accept the fact that it is possible. It is like saying ""does fire always burn ? Is it possible to have a cold fire??"" So, friendship is possible but it will follow a relationship sooner or later. Either the girl makes a boy brother or boy friend. Leave them alone in a single bedroom for a cold night and friendship gets dissolved into love. Sorry to be blunt but this is a fact. If a boy likes a girl's looks why will he only make her a friend?? Why will he not make his steps forward??
| By dipesh on Saturday, September 30, 2000 - 11:07 am: |
Hi,Girls/Womans.
I think man and woman be a good friends if they have understanding with each other. I like girls/womans of free mind and who can make friendship with me and can be frank with me and whom i can say all my personal things good or bad.Any girls/womans like to make frindship email me.
Bye Sweet Girls/Womans
| By Anonymous on Monday, October 02, 2000 - 09:27 pm: |
I am a 34 year old married Indian man. I believe it is not possible for lasting friendship with women without it evolving into a sexual situation. The only thing that prevents it from occurring is the consequences of a sexual encounter. Although I have many women friends, they are more friends of my wife than me. And, any woman friend I had before marriage is now more a "friend" of my wife than me. I do not count any female work acquaintance as a friend.
If I am placed with a woman friend with no consequences of any kind for a sexual diversion, I am sure that the two of us would engage in it. Even if the woman is moderately attractive and is ready to be discrete, why not enjoy the pleasures of sex?
If a woman wants to be a friend, and wants to include intimate moments as part of the friendship without any strings attached, I am pretty sure that most situations would turn into sexual encounters. The only exceptions may be absolutely no physical or personality attractiveness between the two participants.
| By Harish Shah on Friday, October 06, 2000 - 08:57 am: |
As long as they keep within the cultural and moral limits,why not?
| By lucky on Thursday, November 09, 2000 - 01:20 pm: |
hi friends
i have just join the family of indiadating .i am 22 year old boy from india and had been brought up in such an enviornment where people never accept boy and a girl as a good friend but i personnaly believe that its all depends upon the attitude of a person towards other.if one feels that a girl or a boy for that matter understands each other there is nothing wrong in continue as a friend in spite of what other' s say. important thing is you know what you are upto.
i hope that i made little sense.
| By Suraj on Monday, December 04, 2000 - 04:33 am: |
Hi All,
Caution: Long mail meant for serious readers only.
Assumptions I make here:
Friendship : Relationship without sex.
Lovers : Relationship with sex.
Marriage : Societal term for Lovers!!
I am 29, Indian male with interest in studing human behaviour. I love making friends and am a very active person with lots of hobbies with reading being one of them. So, the postings here made good reading. The issue discussed here as to whether a boy and a gal can have friendship without sex makes very less sense to me as we are mixing two issues.
I would say that friendship is always WITHOUT sex. If a couple decides to have sex and has sex then they are no longer friends but infact they now have become lovers.
If anything, one thing is for sure that every body is different [their bringing up, culture, experiences, assumptions, character, judgement, stage in life, mindset & most importantly that unique moment of weakness/strength "THE SITUATION" they are faced with] and is entitled to have his or her own opinion regarding friendship with the opposite sex. We should not make the mistake of looking for hard and fast rules.
MY opinion: A person should not be judged on his personal life. Sex is neither bad/good. It's just another fact of life. Leave it for the two individuals to decide. I do feel strongly that an individual should communicate clearly how he/she feels about the friend they are seeing and should respect the answers he/she gets. Also the friend has greater responsibility to respond clearly if they care for their friends. It's never wrong to tell your friend that you now feel like having sex. Infact it's wrong to PRESUME that sex will follow with friendship.
You got to make that decision to take your relationship to the next level [lovers] consciously and let your friend also have enough time to have a say in it. Never push too hard or corner/trick a friend into yeilding to your rush in their hour of human weakness. It's immoral and just plain wrong. If you succeed in having sex in the way I described, then there is no difference between you and a rapist/maniac and you have no right to call yourself a friend at the first place and so this advise is not for you!!
Friendship is that very temporary first stage relationship you establish with the other individual essentially without sex. Yes we all know that the couples in friendship become lovers with sex involved. Can they be lovers without first being friends; the answer is an absolutely NO. However short that friendship is, it has to exist before a couple become lovers.
Conclusion:
Societal norms change as we travel through different societies in our life time. It's again a personal choice to accept or reject the societal norms!
Life is too short to let the issue of sex bother you to much. The more important thing is whether you were having fun in your life time.
That was my take on the issue we were discussing. friendship & sex.
I would like to hear the response to my posting from friends here. You can reach me at surajban@hotmail.com and I check my mail often reply!
Regards,
Suraj
| By anonymous2 on Thursday, December 21, 2000 - 01:41 am: |
i still like the none serious anonymous who i've now written 2 4 the second time, yeh baby i want u!!!
| By Yasmeen on Thursday, December 28, 2000 - 10:14 am: |
Actually there is only ONE major difference between a friend and a lover and that is sexual intimacy and kissing ( mouth ). You love your friends just as much as your bf/gf but its a different type of love like agape, filos and eros and there was another one i cant remember 
. In short when male/female platonic friendships become sexual they wouldnt be JUST a FRIEND anymore they either become a one night stand or your lover or a dreadful mistake in a moment of passion. Its not worth having a moment of passion and lose a great friendship with someone because of it.